Pick Up Games (PUGs)

[Guest Gliven]

On Tomb, i don't really see what else we could have done. we had plenty of people push out for harv. We actually had the higher kill count at the start. We just couldn't reach their harv. And then even donating people for meds wasn't good enough. Nod already owned the field. As soon as meds peeked around the corner. they lost half their health to arty spam, even with hotwire support. Nod just played a really good round.

[Madkill40]

Unless the Nod team plays really, really poor I rarely see GDI kill the Nod harvester on Tomb, it seems to me that in a lot of cases it is just easier for GDI to defend their harvester from destruction than it is to kill Nod's harvester.

It'd be interesting to see the Med tank price reduced by 50 credits and/or Flame tanks price increased by 50 credits.

[boxes]

On tomb GDI really needed control of the inf-path above the vehicles, that's the only real way you guys could have disrupted repairs and be a nuisance for the tanks

The WF also could have easily been saved, there were engineers outside of the window that were looking in my direction right as I planted my C4s, but they never reacted

Regardless tomb is really hard for GDI to win when their GT is down, it opens up so many infiltration opportunities for Nod

[Guest Gliven]

1 hour ago, CampinJeff said:

On tomb GDI really needed control of the inf-path above the vehicles, that's the only real way you guys could have disrupted repairs and be a nuisance for the tanks

Even with Water killing off repairs the meds couldnt push out. The sheer firepower of the arties demolished the meds as soon as they stuck their noses out.

That and no harvester insured we couldnt replace the ones we lost

Edited July 30, 2017 by Gliven

[Sn4ke]

4 hours ago, Madkill40 said:

It'd be interesting to see the Med tank price reduced by 50 credits and/or Flame tanks price increased by 50 credits.

no.

[Madkill40]

On 7/31/2017 at 0:32 AM, DarkSn4ke said:

no.

[TK0104]

Round 3: Canyon

 

Edited August 1, 2017 by TK0104

[TK0104]

Round 4: Gobi

Edited August 2, 2017 by TK0104

[Ryz]

On 11-7-2017 at 10:47 AM, CampinJeff said:

 

@Ryz Try using names. Saying 2 people do this, 3 people do that, and 5 people do this is impossible for your teammates to organize themselves. And if you really like telling people what to do try volunteering yourself as commander more often.

Sorry, did't check the forum lately... I will!

[TK0104]

Round 5: Whiteout

Edited August 3, 2017 by TK0104

[Sn4ke]

https://youtu.be/ByQyBeBkPLU?t=301

where are the repairs, because we also requested them

alright. welcome to another Renegade X HUD lesson.

if you organise a RUSH or just want to donate for early stuff.

hit 'k' (in case the player list is closed)

hold down 'v' and you can easly SEE how much credit each team mate has. you DO NOT have to go to the ESC - donate menu

And questions like: who needs cash and who needs how much are unnecessary if you use that.

+ only donate as MUCH as the player need to a certain UNIT.

use the remaining cash either for a hottie (field rep) or donate to someone else to gain more firepower

 

@Ryz Dear Ryz,

few days ago we played against each other on the CT Mara - map: walls_fly - you organized a SBH rush on GDI PP which was very successfull, but after that Nod got their asses kicked.

The MRLS tactic on Whiteout failed due to a similar problem. The tactic might (!) work, but most likely only during a public match.

The likelihood that absolutely noone will spot 3-4 MRLS moving for the HoN side is somewhere near zero on a PUG (or on a public server against an organised team). Would be interesting to see/hear a video from boxes team (so you can see when Nod knew about the rush)

And Whiteout is currently a "King of the hill" map. the team who controls the hill, controls the map, as you can easily switch sides (esp. Nod tanks can easily counter meds on the sides via the rocks) + MRLS are no match for SBHs / Arties / LTs

Edited August 3, 2017 by DarkSn4ke

[Sn4ke]

https://youtu.be/ByQyBeBkPLU?t=328

@Ryz what? AFK repairs during a PUG? how do you make up such a conclusion don't get me wrong - no offence meant here. I'd just like to know why you think anyone is AFK-repairng during a PUG (unless someone takes a toilet break, or Yosh needs more booze or another band-aid as he cut his wrist again while walking through the door frame )

Edited August 3, 2017 by DarkSn4ke

[Sn4ke]

GDI tactic for an organized Whiteout match - 15 -vs- 15 -

by Sn4ke

[dedicated field repair n00b since Beta 5.x]

1) kill the harvester / defend your own harvester*

2) if Nod harvy is down / own harvy secured** cap the silo / comms (once you've lost the harvy ony whiteout against a organised PUG crew GDI is doomed, so cap these buildings AFTER the harvy is down / secured!!)

3) As Nod is not dependent on their harvy dump (cheap arties) GDI has to send "anti-arty" units to the hill - and... ONLY the hill is important at this stage

4) send 1-2 skilled MRLS (skilled! tankers) with 2-3 hotties as backup on the hill. add 1 good Patch (counter LCG / SBH), 2 Gunners (to wreck arties & EMP)

5) send furthermore (7 players remaining, excl. dedicated defender / miner) any other available unit to the hill with FREE infantry, esp. soldiers (HS multipl > LCGs > snipers > SBH), grends (splash multipl > snipers & kevlar units) & enigs (additional field rep + kamikaze c4!)

6) donate for 2 mammoth tanks ASAP - 2 more hotwires needed! (only the finest tankers of the team should steer the mammoth tanks...) to dominate the hill

8) once your team has the hill, allow your dedicated sniper to buy either a havoc or a sydney***, then max out Mammoth and go in deep (eventually) [for those who do not feel comfortable with a mammoth tank - get a MED]

9) win****

2)-8) farm any Nod harvy that leaves the airstrip!

* actually saving your own harvy is more important as killing theirs, as GDI needs tons of cash, while Nod only needs arties, arties. arties & infantry backup

** if you've lost your initial harvy you have to TEAM-donate PROPERLY (dont WASTE cash!) or just ragequit

*** there is absolutely NO use in a dedicated havoc / deadeye sniper wasting 500-1000 bucks if GDI does NOT have the hill. a decent dedicated sniper can as well kill / hamper enemy infantry with a soldier (HS 4x multi) - it's free boys!

**** Disclaimer: I'm a poor old Sn4ke and know nothing about nothing. So please forgive me if you follow the steps above and still lose to a Nod team spamming Arties - SBH - LCS - Raver - Stankz - Flamer (hill control)

[Ryz]

9 hours ago, DarkSn4ke said:

 

Dear Ryz,

few days ago we played against each other on the CT Mara - map: walls_fly - you organized a SBH rush on GDI PP which was very successfull, but after that Nod got their asses kicked.

The MRLS tactic on Whiteout failed due to a similar problem. The tactic might (!) work, but most likely only during a public match.

The likelihood that absolutely noone will spot 3-4 MRLS moving for the HoN side is somewhere near zero on a PUG (or on a public server against an organised team). Would be interesting to see/hear a video from boxes team (so you can see when Nod knew about the rush)

And Whiteout is currently a "King of the hill" map. the team who controls the hill, controls the map, as you can easily switch sides (esp. Nod tanks can easily counter meds on the sides via the rocks) + MRLS are no match for SBHs / Arties / LTs

Actually I didn't organize the rush, but I joined it and it worked  That was more luck than anything else, cause someone started shooting the MCT immediatly before we got discovered.

Considering Whiteout. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, but I rather go down trying and lose the game than play the same game with the same gameplay over and over again. Mesa and Whiteout matches are basically 90% percent of all the times I played it the same. For me, and I know others think different about it, a PUG shouldn't be only competitive, but also a place for more 'advanced' and 'daring' gameplay. If we lose trying something I probably had more fun than playing a sort of repeat of the same game with the same tactic. Just my opinion offcourse. 

[Xeon Wraith]

1 hour ago, Ryz said:

Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, but I rather go down trying and lose the game than play the same game with the same gameplay over and over again. Mesa and Whiteout matches are basically 90% percent of all the times I played it the same. For me, and I know others think different about it, a PUG shouldn't be only competitive, but also a place for more 'advanced' and 'daring' gameplay. If we lose trying something I probably had more fun than playing a sort of repeat of the same game with the same tactic. Just my opinion offcourse. 

@Ryz Do keep in mind a lot of players enjoy playing competitively and trying their hardest to win, which usually means following the Most Effective Tactic Available (META). 

The primary issue is that what you've suggested on Whiteout is neither advanced nor daring. In the hypothetical case where your MRLs rush goes unspotted and somehow kills both the Ref and HoN, you've still got a mass of arties on the hill, they've still capable of killing every building in GDI's base and you're still stuck with arguably the worst vehicle in the game at holding field. The idea to go into the tunnels on Canyon has a similar problem. You're not dealing with the issue at hand. It simply doesn't matter how hard you think you've tried when you're actually not trying to deal with the primary problems at all.

The problem with doing this in a PUG is that you're actively taking players and resources away when they could be spent elsewhere and that really sucks for the competitive guys trying not to lose. If you're playing to try different things, you can always try to get a rush going a public game.

Edited August 3, 2017 by Xeon Wraith
A word.

[Guest Gliven]

1 hour ago, Ryz said:

Actually I didn't organize the rush, but I joined it and it worked  That was more luck than anything else, cause someone started shooting the MCT immediatly before we got discovered.

Considering Whiteout. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, but I rather go down trying and lose the game than play the same game with the same gameplay over and over again. Mesa and Whiteout matches are basically 90% percent of all the times I played it the same. For me, and I know others think different about it, a PUG shouldn't be only competitive, but also a place for more 'advanced' and 'daring' gameplay. If we lose trying something I probably had more fun than playing a sort of repeat of the same game with the same tactic. Just my opinion offcourse. 

I dont find throwing matches very fun at all. I dont know many people that do.

Throwing MRLS to the side path is fine, AFTER you take the hill. Controlling the hill, controls the map. You can do what ever tactics you want, after you have achieved the strategic advantage.

Even if you succeeded in destroying the HON, what was your next step? Because i know what would have happend. Nod would still have control over the hill, and our base would have still been blown apart by arties.

Good strat @Ryz you traded a hon for the rest of you base.

[Guest Gliven]

You remind me of Generals from WW1, telling your men to leap from the trenches and run towards the enemy, dodging machine gun fire and artillery barrages. How very daring. Those death marches were pretty organised too. Those generals used "advanced tactics" they learned back in the 1800's.

[Sn4ke]

13 hours ago, Ryz said:

For me, and I know others think different about it, a PUG shouldn't be only competitive, but also a place for more 'advanced' and 'daring' gameplay. If we lose trying something I probably had more fun than playing a sort of repeat of the same game with the same tactic.

okaaaaay, on the TS/Discord recordings you don't sound like you do NOT want to win / play competetive [my opinion]

Reasons why I join the PUG: advanced gameplay, META, coordinated shit with 10 player+ aaand: competition. there is (often) no real competition on public servers. but with balanced PUG teams you'll get skilled players figthing skilled players with commanders kicking their asses to do a good job (or not)

[yosh56]

First and foremost, PUGs are about WINNING and being COMPETITIVE. If they weren't we wouldn't have a freaking draft for teams to [try and] make sure it isn't a roflstomp every time. Secondly, playing competitively means both taking risks, and playing smartly. First, however, it's about making sure you're at least in a position to take risks.. 9/10 @Ryz you have a tendency to call out rushes without the 1st hint of a logical reason behind it (e.g) trying to MRLS rush on Whiteout's sides when there are almost always infantry on the sides and MRLS aren't exactly fast... not to mention the hill being the most important aspect of Whiteout). That's not a 'good' risk at all, as it just leaves you open to getting destroyed, and 4 MRLS aren't going to be hard to stop with no repairs and 15 people on the other team. 

Yes, you can do some weird things in PUGs (like raining black men from helicopters), but you need to be in a decent position to do so 1st, as well as not take risks that completely outweigh their rewards. You lose the MRLS and then what? You've thrown the ENTIRE game.. That's asinine. 

ALSO: I had no idea that's what META stood for.. The more you know ! 

ALSO ALSO: Just because PUGs get played with the META, doesn't mean it's the 'same' gameplay each time. It's just the base game, but how it all ends isn't a guarantee, and that's why it's still fun to slug out arts vs. Meds on Mesa with the possibility of the game being ended by something totally unrelated to them (like APC rushes).  

[TK0104]

Round 6: Arctic Stronghold

 

Edited August 4, 2017 by TK0104

[TK0104]

PUG - August 5th 

Round 1: Walls

Edited August 6, 2017 by TK0104

[TK0104]

Round 2: Volcano

Edited August 6, 2017 by TK0104

[TK0104]

Round 3: Snow

Edited August 7, 2017 by TK0104

[RoundShades]

PUGs were alright, really felt like we could have saved that HoN though. If nobody read gamechat, that sounds like a fundamental gameplay problem to me.

[Schmitzenbergh]

Is it a bird, is it a plane? NO! It's the amazing flying @Ryz!

[Guest Gliven]

1 hour ago, YagiHige said:

PUGs were alright, really felt like we could have saved that HoN though. If nobody read gamechat, that sounds like a fundamental gameplay problem to me.

lol what? we also yelled about the hon, we had gdi camped in their base. We knew full well about the sydneys coming long before they got there. We just didnt have the manpower in-base to kill them. We had GDI locked into their base. It was less about ignoring the team-chat and more about people unwilling to suicide to come back.

Edited August 12, 2017 by Gliven

[Xtractor]

2 hours ago, Schmitzenbergh said:

Is it a bird, is it a plane? NO! It's the amazing flying @Ryz!

 Thats amazing

[RoundShades]

6 hours ago, Gliven said:

lol what? we also yelled about the hon, we had gdi camped in their base. We knew full well about the sydneys coming long before they got there. We just didnt have the manpower in-base to kill them. We had GDI locked into their base. It was less about ignoring the team-chat and more about people unwilling to suicide to come back.

Everytime I infiltrate a PP, 7 people suicide and spawn right there with me, die, and spawn again.

Yet, 2 sydneys come to HoN, and crickets.

My life summarized.

[Sn4ke]

5 hours ago, YagiHige said:

Everytime I infiltrate a PP, 7 people suicide and spawn right there with me, die, and spawn again.

Yet, 2 sydneys come to HoN, and crickets.

My life summarized.

Curse of RenX.

 

[TK0104]

PUG - August 12th 2017

 

Round 1: Complex

Edited August 13, 2017 by TK0104

[Quinc3y]

Despite the score being 3-0, teams felt pretty balanced and if our defence was more strict and we had some more luck, I think we could have won each of the 3 games. 

Decent PUG. 

[Ryz]

20 hours ago, Schmitzenbergh said:

Is it a bird, is it a plane? NO! It's the amazing flying @Ryz!

Nice

[Ryz]

19 hours ago, Gliven said:

lol what? we also yelled about the hon, we had gdi camped in their base. We knew full well about the sydneys coming long before they got there. We just didnt have the manpower in-base to kill them. We had GDI locked into their base. It was less about ignoring the team-chat and more about people unwilling to suicide to come back.

The problem is, which I also stated yesterday, that the there was first a written message which said that people were going towards the bridge, than an EMP message, later that the building was attacked. At that point we had 30 seconds to react which was too late, but if someone would have acted earlier we might have saved it...

Shit happens, but maybe we should select key defenders not only by skill but also by the ability to use a microphone. I spotted the written message in teamchat and said it out loud, but I tend to miss a lot of written teamchat when there is also spoken communication. 

[Calvin]

17 hours ago, Ryz said:

The problem is, which I also stated yesterday, that the there was first a written message which said that people were going towards the bridge, than an EMP message, later that the building was attacked. At that point we had 30 seconds to react which was too late, but if someone would have acted earlier we might have saved it...

Shit happens, but maybe we should select key defenders not only by skill but also by the ability to use a microphone. I spotted the written message in teamchat and said it out loud, but I tend to miss a lot of written teamchat when there is also spoken communication. 

It was called out instantly 

[Ryz]

1 hour ago, poi said:

It was called out instantly 

I am pretty sure it was typed first, but if you say so....

[Calvin]

the person that was defending and got killed first called it out.. 

[Quinc3y]

Think it was called out on discord as soon as mines went down, but 1) on Goldrush HoN is far and unreachable with vehicles, 2) most of us were busy in the field, 3) it wasn't just a lone hotwire, but 2 sydneys, which are much more of a challenge.

[Sn4ke]

1 hour ago, Quincy said:

Think it was called out on discord as soon as mines went down

ZZZ called it out as soon as he saw the 2 Syds inc. so even before the mines went down. (I think)

[Guest Gliven]

My opinion about what we "should" have done, was have someone constantly run around the infantry path with a doza all match, plus have ZZZ defend the hon/pp while also watching for river divers going for strip. Other than that. The sydneys powered their way through and killed the hon. Game over. Move on.

[Guest Gliven]

If you feel the need to blame others on their poor defence, do it yourself next time.

[boxes]

15 minutes ago, Gliven said:

My opinion about what we "should" have done, was have someone constantly run around the infantry path with a doza all match

afaik poi was there all game but yosh and I eventually decided to hide around a corner near the nod tower and wait for poi to go deep into the inf path. Actually (after watching thommy's vid) ZZZ made a pretty bad error not calling us out the moment I killed him when he was behind the boxes at the end of the Nod bridge. In fact right after I got the pick I EMPd the bridge which there he should have made the call (did not happen). When he did make the call, Yosh and I already planted our C4s and were already breaking the armor with the PICs

If he did make the call in time, poi would have ran back and likely killed both of us before we're able to destroy the building

[TK0104]

Round 2: GoldRush

Edited August 15, 2017 by TK0104

[TK0104]

Round 3: Walls

Edited August 15, 2017 by TK0104

[TK0104]

Sadly, I won't be playing PUG tonight because some people are coming over to my place to eat and then we head over to a firework show to celebrate the end of the holiday (Yeah, dafuq )

[yosh56]

@TK0104 : Way to miss one of the actual good, balanced ones =\

[Madkill40]

8 minutes ago, yosh56 said:

@TK0104 : Way to miss one of the actual good, balanced ones =\

Yeah @TK0104 you absolute ballbagbaebump!!

[Ryz]

Sorry I had to leave during the last game. Never expected the PUG to last this long. Was good games! Anyone doing recap?

[ex_member]

This PUG was one of the best I have played.

When the teams are balanced, the fun factor in this game is enormous.

[SMayhew]

Yeah a very good PUG!

Won't be there next weekend unfortunately.

[yosh56]

Good PUG. A shame I was falling asleep because I remembered to go get alcohol at the store, but not coffee =\. That's also why I cut out right after the PUG like that.