Gameplay Tutorials

[TK0104]

Hi there,

 

If you readed the title, you already know what's all this about. I've been playing Renegade X a lot over the past years and I still keep reading the problem that new players don't know how to play this game. One of the biggest issues with new players is that they have zero knowledge about mining the base. That's the main reason why I started this topic and YouTube series.

So as I said new players don't know to mine or what to do with mines. Mines are basicly used for defending the base from sneakers that want to solo kill a structure (like me). New players don't know that and starting to mine on random spots like: the field, the tunnels or even the enemy's base. And of course people that DO know how to mine start to complain the mining is bad and start to shout at people: "[Player] stop overmining!!!" and sometimes even wants to mine ban the player. Luckly that does not happens that much, but you get the point right?

So here's the first tutorial, the tutorial that shows you how to mine the base properly.

 

I hope you guys understand the meaning of this series. It's not about the views, subsribers or likes. Once again, it's about showing new players how to play the game.

 

Cheers!,

 

TK0104

Edited July 26, 2017 by TK0104

[Schmitzenbergh]

I like the vid @TK0104. Good initiative! I can't say I agree with all the mine placements, but as a starter I really like the video. The über-miners of the RenX community should give you some remarks on the mining. Anyway, keep up the good work! Maybe reupload it with a barracks part as on some maps you need to mine the doors instead of the sandbags. (Or even mine the internal 'doors' to prevent emps.)

 

[Sn4ke]

Hey @TK0104,

your video is a basic mining tutorial and I really appreciate your initiative, but I'd like too see another mining tutorial which is focusing on different mining strategies instead of your personal style only.

Mining in Renegade X is... far from trivial. There is no single perfect way how to mine properly, but some strategies have proven to be more efficient than others.

 

Different mining strategies:

the majority of the RenX defenders place their mines like this..

pro: while placed directly in the threshold you might be able to get unseasoned sneakers by surpise

con: any nearby enemy vehicle will trigger the mines and "disarm" them instantly

you can also place mines further back

pro: (most) enemy vehicles can't trigger the mines [vehicles with gun turrets still can!!]

con: if placed too far from the door, sneakers might be able to bypass them

quite a few defenders like to "hide" mines around corners / in textures...

pro: mines are more difficult to spot & disarm (if sunk into texture)

con: sneakers can avoid at least one mine..

Note: I present this strategy for the record. I can NOT recommend it!

sneakers can avoid one mine completely by moving along the opposite side of the doorframe

a lot of miners love to place proximity mines around the corner of the Ref door [Tib dump entrance] - same as above... sneakers can completely avoid that mine [right mine], but they have to disarm the left mine

 

Mining the HoN [with ramps]:

no matter which window the sneaker might choose, he has to disarm two mines to get to the MCT
 

Note: mining the ramps is only advisable on non flying maps [e.g. Fort]

 

Mining the Airstrip tower [with ramp]:

the mines here will ensure any sneaker has to disarm at least three mines to get to the MCT - no matter if he uses the roof or the door. you can place one mine on the ramp / door

 

Mining GDI barracks:

above: two mines per door, three "emergency" mines inside the bar - EMP at the door will not affect these

above: two mines at the sandbags, one per door and four at the MCT

Note: this is only recommended on maps where infantry can't jump onto the sandbags!

 

Mining the GDI WF ramp:

for the WF ramp there is absolutely no better way to mine it. if you do not place the mines on the railing, Nod sneakers (most likely SBH) are able to glitch upon the WF roof...

 

Mining the tunnel on Walls:

placing the mines exactly in the middle will guarantee mine triggering - even if the enemy moves along the tunnel wall

 

About mine-stacking:

Stacking mines uses the element of surprise. In general it can work, but it's not advisable to use this mining method against seasoned players.

Also, if mines disappear you have to remove all your stacked mines and replace them to ensure that you still have the correct amount in place. And other teammates who are defending / mining the base as well might think that you only placed a single mine (if they don't look closely) and place additional mines (result: overmining...).

Regards,

Sn4ke

Edited July 26, 2017 by DarkSn4ke
forgot the damn airstrip tower screenshot -_-

[Jarzey]

First - there is no perfect way to mine.

I will say, to become a dedicated miner, you have to know every map and every path at its fullest. Good miners are often infiltrators, since they know which path to use, where to hide, and from where you can best get into the buildings, and they can employ such knowledge when mining. Of course, you do not have to become good at sneaking to be good at mining, but it helps.

Most importantly, you will have to constant watch the mine limit (perhaps a mutator that enlarges the mine limit font to occupy the whole screen might be helpful... or not). Many players will mine the base up and then go do stuff in field, often forgetting about them or leaving mine management to the ones in base. Since most of the people think this way in pubs (after all, being a dedicated defender is usually boring), it is not surprising that no one ends up regularly checking on mines, thus when a building blows up, players are quick to rant and play the blaming game.

So, if you want truly become a good miner, you might as well become a dedicated defender; and ask your team that you are to be the only one allowed to mine the base (this will never happen in pubs, I reckon), and keep watch of the mine limit. Just placing mines and not watching over them is one of the main reasons why infiltrators manage to get in.

Theoretically, the best mine positioning would be to place all the mines on the same spot, so that infiltrators cannot pull off the "mine sweep" tactic, which consists of disarming all the mines to around 5% first and then sweeping all of them away in quick succession. In practice this would cause extensive confusion as there would be no way to tell how many mines a door has. So the best placement would be putting them close enough that you can see how many there are, while it still remains hard to disarm one specific mine at once.

Personally I would avoid mining inf paths as it will create false alarms in base and you will have to go around checking all the buildings when those mines are lost. But by no means mining inf paths is something bad; especially if those inf paths are the only sneaky paths that lead to the base (example, Under's tunnels may be mined, Xmountain's entrance inf path should not be mined), albeit I still find it safer when all the mines are inside buildings.

About EMP's: mining inside the building "should" work well for maps without automated defenses: it prevents EMP from disarming the doors, takes the defender near to PTs for quick refills, and shelters him from enemy tank fire. However, the main reason to not mine just inside - the infiltrator is more unlikely to be spotted while he disarms (this also applies with EMP). Chances of spotting the sneaking player are much higher when he is outside, because your teammates spend more time running to the field than staying inside buildings. In addition, infiltrators might be able to hide inside the building (think behind the open locker door in the barracks, or at the bottom floor of the air tower), or skillfully throw the C4 across the mines (albeit it can only really happen inside pp). Regarding outside EMP's, if there is a dedicated defender, he would be able to spot the EMP going off most of the time and repair the mines (if he is currently inside the building, albeit they usually patrol around in vehicles), or warn the team, at least in pug matches.

Said that, my preferred way of mining is to use all the mines for the buildings, ignoring the inf paths. I would not place 3 mines at every door, but rather a different amount of mines for each building; for example, I would put 4 on each ref door, 3 on each hon door, and 5 on air door, so I have better chances knowing which building the infiltrator is inside - 4 mines down = ref, 3 mines down = hon, 5 mines down = air. Since most of the time the mine limit will not allow such frugal mining, I usually prioritize the back doors with different mine numbers; more mines will be added up to each door should a building fall. Granted, this tactic is not perfect, as a mine could have been lost to a random enemy wandering in base and the sneaking player got into the building with 3 mines, or there are multiple infiltrators, but it certainly helps identifying the whereabouts of the infiltrator. You may also get away by just putting 1 mine at front doors that are well covered by automated defenses - as long you are watchful for spies (this tactic shown here will most probably get you called "overminer" since players are not used to seeing such).

In certain maps (Lakeside is a good example here), I would also put the mines for ref front door outside the door, but in between the small opening that leads to the door - so the infiltrator cannot crouch at the sides of such opening and avoid automated defenses fire. Due to the collision blocker, vehicles will not be able to pop those mines up (remember than the mines' trigger radius is far smaller for vehicles - basically you almost have to drive over them).

Flying maps are more complicated: generally, it is safer to mine the inside rather than ramps (with exception of WF to prevent nukes on the vast WF roof; mining behind the corner at the end of the stairs could surprise someone), as players dropping from aerial vehicles would be able to get into hon or air without ever stepping on the ramps. Air is easy to mine up - just place mines at the junction with the MCT and bottom of the air tower; hon is a different story. Depending on the amount of mines remaining, I would commit up to 6 ~ 9 mines to cover the second floor and the ramp, with 2~3 on the ramp and both sides.

If a team has only one building standing, often excess mines are placed around the edges of the building to prevent beacon placement; I do not recommend this since beacons can also be placed some distance away: their range might be small, about the size of a Tib Silo dome, but they do not have to be glued up to the building in order to succeed. I would rather mine up inf paths and put the remainder in the last building.

Overall, I will say this is the best advice: there is no point in mining if you are not going to keep track of your mines.

Edited July 26, 2017 by Jarzey

[Guest Gliven]

31 minutes ago, Jarzey said:

Said that, my preferred way of mining is to use all the mines for the buildings, ignoring the inf paths. I would not place 3 mines at every door, but rather a different amount of mines for each building; for example, I would put 4 on each ref door, 3 on each hon door, and 5 on air door, so I have better chances knowing which building the infiltrator is inside - 4 mines down = ref, 3 mines down = hon, 5 mines down = air. Since most of the time the mine limit will not allow such frugal mining, I usually prioritize the back doors with different mine numbers; more mines will be added up to each door should a building fall. Granted, this tactic is not perfect, as a mine could have been lost to a random enemy wandering in base and the sneaking player got into the building with 3 mines, or there are multiple infiltrators, but it certainly helps identifying the whereabouts of the infiltrator. You may also get away by just putting 1 mine at front doors that are well covered by automated defenses - as long you are watchful for spies (this tactic shown here will most probably get you called "overminer" since players are not used to seeing such).

This is how i like to mine the base

[Madkill40]

A nice straight forward video that displays the basic usage of mines which is acceptable for any new player, good job, Thommy.

Any further input regarding creative tactical mining comes with experience to be fair.

[swaffelen]

Personally I like to place fewer mines at entrances that have good visibility such as the front door of the HON and WF on walls. I also like to put 1 mine in between the sand bags of the BAR on non-flying maps such as Reservoir. That way, you can see from far away whether or not you need to check the mines for the bar. On Reservoir, it is especially handy since the buildings are far apart and every second counts when someone has infiltrated with a techie or a nuke.

EDIT: apparently you can jump on/over the sandbags now... that logic makes not sense to me but whatever.

Edited July 31, 2017 by swaffelen

[Sn4ke]

8 hours ago, swaffelen said:

between the sand bags of the BAR on non-flying maps such as Reservoir.

you can jump onto the sandbags on Reservoir..

[vandal33]

Most people like placing 3 mines at door. There are pros and cons but a single EMP grenade can disarm all, I like putting mines far from each other (but the infiltrator still needs to disarm 3 to get to the MCT) like f.e. the front door of a refinery: 1 at the door, 1 behind the mine at the door and 1 just behind the wall to the left corridor. If somebody throws an EMP, only the one at the door will be affected. But the criticism of this placement is that only 1 mine needs to be disarmed while the infiltrator is outdoor and he can disarm the other 2 while already inside the building so he has less time being exposed but screw it, no mine placement is perfect.

This works better against EMP infiltrators than repair gun/tool users but other players can notice the mine count drop (since the mines are placed a bit further from each other, it takes more time to disarm all 3 and more time for players to realize a mine drop) and people respawning/camping inside the building can still counter the infiltrator even if it is a hotwire/technician.

[SMayhew]

Good work Thommy.  It's good to have a basic mining video to help newcomers out. Maybe you/someone can do an advanced one some time down the line.

[swaffelen]

On 7/27/2017 at 5:28 AM, DarkSn4ke said:

you can jump onto the sandbags on Reservoir..

Wait... what?!? that doesn't seem right. what is the point of sandbags then?

[Sn4ke]

5 minutes ago, swaffelen said:

Wait... what?!? that doesn't seem right. what is the point of sandbags then?

the point of sandbags: they narrow the entrance to GDI bar

well... you can jump on top of the sandbags on most of the maps. players just need to find the higher spot and that requires at least some RenX knowledge & experience.

[LavaDr4gon]

17 minutes ago, swaffelen said:

Wait... what?!? that doesn't seem right. what is the point of sandbags then?

The real question is, what's the point of barb wire on top of the sandbags?

[vandal33]

52 minutes ago, swaffelen said:

what is the point of sandbags then?

Soldiers to take cover behind them. But the barb wire....

[Henk]

Used to be possible on Islands & Goldrush as well, maybe unintentionally. Possible on Tunnels too, and Snow for as long as this patch lasts. Pro tactics  .