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Impressions from a new player and why I think the game sucks


Thedude
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When I watched the trailer this looked like a promising game. But, in it's current state I am disappointed with it and while it would be become awesome if some of the things I'm going to list now would change, I highly doubt they will since I've never seen developers listen to feedback and really change something without sticking to their point of view.

Bear in mind that this point of view comes from a new player.

1. The movement speed of infantry units is too fast. It simply feels like a run and gun game, instead of a tactical team based game. You constantly see players hopping around running and shooting which breaks the immersion and makes me think this game isn't serious at all.

Solution

-Reduce the sprint speed by 15%, and normal movement speed by 5%

2. As an infantry player I feel like I don't have a goal.

Solution:

- Does a commander unit exist? If so give him the option to set waypoints for infantry players and vehicles. Those waypoints would show on the infantry players screen and they would have a goal to complete.

3. Higher tier infantry units are personalized and have names and on top of that they aren't limited to 1 per faction so you see a lot of clones hopping around the battlefield which breaks immersion.

4. TTK is too high. So far every game I know that had a low TTK was more tactical, simply because players weren't so encouraged to leave cover because they would get shot faster. It encouraged teamplay.

5. Give the players incentive to move together. Add the ability to form squads, and if the squad moves in an area of 10 meters from one another they would receive bigger rewards as the result.

6. Remove the horrible kill sound or make it optional, I know it's sacred to some of ya but it simply ruins immersion.

I can't stress enough how immersion is important in contributing towards the success of the game.

I will leave this game now, and hopefully if these things get fixed I'll return. I wish the developers luck and I really hope you listen to these suggestion because this game has enormous potential. Good luck!

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It's Renegade you don't like - not Renegade X.

The game is based off of the game. That won't change.

It's clear you've never played the original, and so you don't yet fully understand this game.

Renegade was one of the most active clanwars.cc leagues and one of the most competitive games of its time (and the following 8 years or so).

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I can understand your frustration. If your biggest problem is lack of immersion and cheesy effects, then perhaps renegade simply isn't your game. Things such as the bunny hopping, characters, and boink are all core parts of the game and its culture.

As for your other complaints. Infantry move speed is fine. The sprint is new, but infantry moving this fast is a necessity in order for them to reach any location quickly (which they still have a rough time with compared to vehicles). If you don't know where to go, perhaps you just aren't familiar with the maps. Also, working together as a team is extremely important and effective, far more than LoneWolfing. Renegade is a very different type of FPS, less tactical and more strategic (there's a difference), and it might just not be your kind of game. Sorry to have lost you.

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Dude, you came to the wrong game.

The game tries to be true to the original, which was a bit arcady. Infantry have a large role in the whole scheme of killing the other base. You just haven't played it enough to feel the needs of the correct infantry yet. The higher tier units are personalized, and that helped identifying the units and their weapons. This will not break immersion for most old Renegade players and is just getting used to.

TTK is again more arcady. You need to really hit more often and longer than other games. The original Renegade was famed for this.

Teamplay is already the only way forward. Right now the servers are packed with new people who can't play it well yet and are just attacking alone, sometimes near each other. It's no pack. Bigger bonuses would make teamplay way too strong, as you are already rewarded by playing much, much better.

I can agree with the kill sound. It is a favourite of mine, but can understand that new players might not want this sound. The solution to turn it off or put another preset one in place should deal with that.

This game does not go for immersion through simulating reality, but through the way to play. Attacking bases, creating units and earning credits are all part of that.

All in all, there is a lot of tactics involved. It is just not the way you are used to.

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The game is supposed to be absolutely over the top. You're playing a commando who goes around nuking buildings while standing 30 meters away and yelling "IT'S TIME TO ROCK AND ROLL", and then turns around and instantly shoots 5 people with a single shot from his railgun, and then exclaiming that it was a left handed shot!

Your goals? Depends on your faction.

GDI: Serve the public trust, protect the innocent, and uphold the law. Also kill all dem baddies in Nod.

Nod: PURGE THE MISGUIDED GDI, SHOW THEM THE WAY OF KANE... AND TIBERIUM SANDWICHES FOR ALL.

The easiest way to carry out these goals is to destroy your enemy's base, and killing all his special infantry units with extreme prejudice.

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Also, working together as a team is extremely important and effective, far more than LoneWolfing. Renegade is a very different type of FPS, less tactical and more strategic (there's a difference), and it might just not be your kind of game. Sorry to have lost you.

I'd argue it's more tactical and less strategical than other modern FPS games.

Those games you go into with a set plan per map and execute it. Renegade/Renegade X plans are constantly changing in order to adapt to the enemy's tactics. If you go into a map with a plan and do not plan on changing up on that plan, you'll likely lose pretty much every game.

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Looks like I really did pick the wrong game then. Too bad they don't make mature games anymore.

Well isn't battlefield 7 coming out soon? Or CoD 9? UT 2015 might be mature enough? And GTA 5 might be close to a PC release.

Your statement is kind of rude. This team has put in several years of their time to construct an updated game. Much more so than the consecutive games of CoD or Battlefield. I'm not sure what you mean with maturity, but this game has just other focuses and does not want to be another clone from the games we already have. If you want a "mature" totally free game, you are welcome to create one yourself. If not, there are so many alternatives, some of which "free to play", that I don't understand that you took time to be rude on this forum.

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Looks like I really did pick the wrong game then. Too bad they don't make mature games anymore.

Sure they do.

Go check out Sims. I think you'd appreciate the realism of it, but probably complain on the lack of available facial features.

Skyrim has 1000% more realism than The Sims. Check that out. Nothing gets more real than dragons.

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Looks like I really did pick the wrong game then. Too bad they don't make mature games anymore.

Okay, I was polite in responding to your other comments, but this kind of statement is just rude. We don't tolerate this kind of behaviour in the Renegade community, so either prepare to have fun and kick ass or leave.

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Looks like I really did pick the wrong game then. Too bad they don't make mature games anymore.

Sure they do.

Go check out Sims. I think you'd appreciate the realism of it, but probably complain on the lack of available facial features.

Skyrim has 1000% more realism than The Sims. Check that out. Nothing gets more real than dragons.

Game is too open for him. Makes him feel insecure. He already posted in their forums about it, no worries.

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When I watched the trailer this looked like a promising game. But, in it's current state I am disappointed with it and while it would be become awesome if some of the things I'm going to list now would change, I highly doubt they will since I've never seen developers listen to feedback and really change something without sticking to their point of view.

Bear in mind that this point of view comes from a new player.

1. The movement speed of infantry units is too fast. It simply feels like a run and gun game, instead of a tactical team based game. You constantly see players hopping around running and shooting which breaks the immersion and makes me think this game isn't serious at all.

Solution

-Reduce the sprint speed by 15%, and normal movement speed by 5%

4. TTK is too high. So far every game I know that had a low TTK was more tactical, simply because players weren't so encouraged to leave cover because they would get shot faster. It encouraged teamplay.

No offense but you sound exactly like yet another overspoiled "gamer" who cant do shit in any game that requires actuall skill,thus needing the game to either change and become dumbed down or he'll leave it without trying to adapt.

Sadly the modern generation of shooters like COD and Battlefield raised a generation of gamers who cant shoot for shit,and think camping a corner is "tactical" which is a huge pile of crap to be honest.

High move speed and TTK reward skilled players with good aim(thus breaking the "immersion" of players with 10% accuracy thinking that they are actually good at FPS games,the moment they go up againt at any really decent player)and they also reward REAL team work,as in sticking together,rotating when you a team m8 takes damage,focus firing and playing your general role in a bit more specialized way(as in accepting that you are not suppose to go up against heavily armed infantry with an engineer class and expecting a fair fight).

It may not be the oversimplistic teamwork of battlefield,where pressing Q and beeing a spawn point for your squad is considered "highest level of tacticool teamplay",but once you get the hang of it and play with friends it's actually much more fun and gratifying,in my opinion.

If you wanna see what a real tacticly demanding shooter takes check this out:

(might wanna skip a few mins in)

The reason why a "simple" arena shooter like quake takes MUCH more tactical awereness than anything COD/BF or even ARMA has to offer,is EXACTLY because the firefights doesnt end in 0.002 seconds,because of that you need to slowly out damage your oponent,outsmart him,play mind games with him,abuse you map knowedge to the max and make multiple tactical decisions per second and on the fly,deciding how you want to engage and if you want to engage in the first place.

I know it can be hard,once you are use to playing only easy mode shooters,to go to any remotely high skillcaped FPS game,but it's totally worth the initial effort in my opinion.

One thing that is very pointless though,is to bash a game for not beeing YET ANOTHERr easy mode generic shooter with gameplay designed mainly around consoles and gamepads,and THE REASON for that is because,that's what 99% of the FPS games out there are like,you can always find yourself plenty of easy mode "tactical shooters" why try to change one of THE VERY FEW remaining old school more skillbased games?

I would be able to understand,not relate,but understand your rant ,if it was the other way around,if there were hardly any casual low TTK shooters and the market was overcrowded with high TTK games,than it would make sense that if that's not your cup of tea,you would be sick of it.

However that is TOTALLY not the case.

And btw I am saying this as someone who has very vast experience on games like bf and played them on highest competitive ESL level,I have to say I am just sick and tired of this overhyped same old crap,I crave so old school freshness and while I do deffinetly have gripes with renegade X and while I am deffinetly a new player to the game(bearly played the original)I do VERY much appreciate it for what it is and I hope they wont dumb it down in order to catter to you(although to be honest some of your ideas werent bad,I even kinda like the squads idea actually,it's just you TTK and movement suggestion that I couldnt possibly disagree more with).

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Calling a game not-mature isn't an insult, you yourself called it arcady. I don't see how you can call a game mature that has a boink sound when you kill someone, and is about

The game is supposed to be absolutely over the top. You're playing a commando who goes around nuking buildings while standing 30 meters away and yelling "IT'S TIME TO ROCK AND ROLL", and then turns around and instantly shoots 5 people with a single shot from his railgun, and then exclaiming that it was a left handed shot!

We all have our different tastes, and that's ok. I just thought this game was different than all the other shoot them up arcady games like Battlefield, Call of Duty and so on.

Again this isn't an insult, we just have different tastes.

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When I watched the trailer this looked like a promising game. But, in it's current state I am disappointed with it and while it would be become awesome if some of the things I'm going to list now would change, I highly doubt they will since I've never seen developers listen to feedback and really change something without sticking to their point of view.

Bear in mind that this point of view comes from a new player.

1. The movement speed of infantry units is too fast. It simply feels like a run and gun game, instead of a tactical team based game. You constantly see players hopping around running and shooting which breaks the immersion and makes me think this game isn't serious at all.

Solution

-Reduce the sprint speed by 15%, and normal movement speed by 5%

4. TTK is too high. So far every game I know that had a low TTK was more tactical, simply because players weren't so encouraged to leave cover because they would get shot faster. It encouraged teamplay.

No offense but you sound exactly like yet another overspoiled "gamer" who cant do shit in any game that requires actuall skill,thus needing the game to either change and become dumbed down or he'll leave it without trying to adapt.

Sadly the modern generation of shooters like COD and Battlefield raised a generation of gamers who cant shoot for shit,and think camping a corner is "tactical" which is a huge pile of crap to be honest.

High move speed and TTK reward skilled players with good aim(thus breaking the "immersion" of players with 10% accuracy thinking that they are actually good at FPS games,the moment they go up againt at any really decent player)and they also reward REAL team work,as in sticking together,rotating when you a team m8 takes damage,focus firing and playing your general role in a bit more specialized way(as in accepting that you are not suppose to go up against heavily armed infantry with an engineer class and expecting a fair fight).

It may not be the oversimplistic teamwork of battlefield,where pressing Q and beeing a spawn point for your squad is considered "highest level of tacticool teamplay",but once you get the hang of it and play with friends it's actually much more fun and gratifying,in my opinion.

If you wanna see what a real tacticly demanding shooter takes check this out:

(might wanna skip a few mins in)

The reason why a "simple" arena shooter like quake takes MUCH more tactical awereness than anything COD/BF or even ARMA has to offer,is EXACTLY because the firefights doesnt end in 0.002 seconds,because of that you need to slowly out damage your oponent,outsmart him,play mind games with him,abuse you map knowedge to the max and make multiple tactical decisions per second and on the fly,deciding how you want to engage and if you want to engage in the first place.

I know it can be hard,once you are use to playing only easy mode shooters,to go to any remotely high skillcaped FPS game,but it's totally worth the initial effort in my opinion.

One thing that is very pointless though,is to bash a game for not beeing YET ANOTHERr easy mode generic shooter with gameplay designed mainly around consoles and gamepads,and THE REASON for that is because,that's what 99% of the FPS games out there are like,you can always find yourself plenty of easy mode "tactical shooters" why try to change one of THE VERY FEW remaining old school more skillbased games?

I would be able to understand,not relate,but understand your rant ,if it was the other way around,if there were hardly any casual low TTK shooters and the market was overcrowded with high TTK games,than it would make sense that if that's not your cup of tea,you would be sick of it.

However that is TOTALLY not the case.

And btw I am saying this as someone who has very vast experience on games like bf and played them on highest competitive ESL level,I have to say I am just sick and tired of this overhyped same old crap,I crave so old school freshness and while I do deffinetly have gripes with renegade X and while I am deffinetly a new player to the game(bearly played the original)I do VERY much appreciate it for what it is and I hope they wont dumb it down in order to catter to you(although to be honest some of your ideas werent bad,I even kinda like the squads idea actually,it's just you TTK and movement suggestion that I couldnt possibly disagree more with).

When did I ever say in this thread that I am a fan of Battlefield or Call of Duty. You're having prejudice towards me.

First of all, a game that has higher TTK isn't more skill reliant it's more equipment reliant. And the easy mod shooter you are describing matches this game more than even Call of Duty which I find kiddish. My tastes go more for mods like Project Reality, or even Americas Army game where tactics and skill actually come to play. I don't play them because they don't have any form of persistence.

You think you would have the balls to rush like G.I. Joe if sticking your head out of cover would mean dying? I don't think so.

You have the right to your opinion, and it isn't ok to insult me since I didn't do that to you but I will ignore it because I didn't come here to fight.

We all have our different tastes, no need to insult eachother over that.

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Calling a game not-mature isn't an insult, you yourself called it arcady. I don't see how you can call a game mature that has a boink sound when you kill someone, and is about
The game is supposed to be absolutely over the top. You're playing a commando who goes around nuking buildings while standing 30 meters away and yelling "IT'S TIME TO ROCK AND ROLL", and then turns around and instantly shoots 5 people with a single shot from his railgun, and then exclaiming that it was a left handed shot!

We all have our different tastes, and that's ok. I just thought this game was different than all the other shoot them up arcady games like Battlefield, Call of Duty and so on.

Again this isn't an insult, we just have different tastes.

too bad this never happens in Renegade. you actually have to act like a team to pull off something 'crazy'. and i don't see how a kill sound changes a lot about the game's maturity. it's about the gameplay, remember that. :P

but too bad you don't seem to like the game. the developers and the community has done it's best to bring this game to where it is right now. but it's allright to have an opinion. :P

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Calling a game not-mature isn't an insult, you yourself called it arcady. I don't see how you can call a game mature that has a boink sound when you kill someone, and is about
The game is supposed to be absolutely over the top. You're playing a commando who goes around nuking buildings while standing 30 meters away and yelling "IT'S TIME TO ROCK AND ROLL", and then turns around and instantly shoots 5 people with a single shot from his railgun, and then exclaiming that it was a left handed shot!

We all have our different tastes, and that's ok. I just thought this game was different than all the other shoot them up arcady games like Battlefield, Call of Duty and so on.

Again this isn't an insult, we just have different tastes.

too bad this never happens in Renegade. you actually have to act like a team to pull off something 'crazy'. and i don't see how a kill sound changes a lot about the game's maturity. it's about the gameplay, remember that. :P

but too bad you don't seem to like the game. the developers and the community has done it's best to bring this game to where it is right now. but it's allright to have an opinion. :P

I ain't denying the developers work, it looks amazing and the strategy element of it is great and that's why It saddens me to find out it's actually meant to be arcady. And I don't doubt that teamwork is present in clans and when playing with friends, but I was referring to public play.

Thank you for a mature response bro!

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I'm not sure if Renegade-X is including modes other than AoW but if they are, new players also need to understand that. CTF was by far my favorite mode during the original Renegade and it's worlds apart from AoW. Also, a lot of the initial gameplay right now is just pure chaos as players learn how the game works and subsequently how to work as a team. Once things settle down games will play out a lot differently. That's just something that all people new to the game should bare in mind.

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Sadly the modern generation of shooters like COD and Battlefield raised a generation of gamers who cant shoot for shit,and think camping a corner is "tactical" which is a huge pile of crap to be honest.

What is ambushing, you dolt? Fair fights are for shitters. "Boohoo COD and BF" is not an argument, either. False premise.

The reason why a "simple" arena shooter like quake takes MUCH more tactical awereness than anything COD/BF or even ARMA has to offer,is EXACTLY because the firefights doesnt end in 0.002 seconds

"I am rubbish at ARMA and keep dying, best stick to calling others bad"

And btw I am saying this as someone who has very vast experience on games like bf and played them on highest competitive ESL level

"I am too fat to do actual sports and need to act like e-sports matter"

I wanted to like the game 'cause I used to like the C&C series, but it's painfully obvious that this one's only for grognards who cannot stop nostalgia-tripping. Improvements are banned, I guess. Enjoy your Stone Age.

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This thread is priceless. This guy is obviously, like others have said, a spoiled brat gamer who doesn't belong here. We welcome you to return to COD.

Nice ad hominem, clown. Are you trying to revive the community or kill it? Obviously the only community you want consists of people who are afraid of change.

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Afraid of change or just..aware of what we like in a game?

I don't understand your hostility at all. Don't like the game? Leave the forum and quit playing.

People need to understand, beta phase is for bug fixes and patches. It's not for the community to have an opportunity to redevelop the game.

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When you remake a game from 2002 it's only a matter of time before people come on who never played the original and complain it's not like Battlefield or CoD. It shows the sad state of affairs when these two games dictate how an FPS should play to an entire generation of gamers.

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I don't understand your hostility at all. Don't like the game? Leave the forum and quit playing.

It is OK to be hostile towards people who disagree. This was amply demonstrated by those who responded to the OP.

Why are you so butthurt? Leave the foooorum boohoooo

When you remake a game from 2002 it's only a matter of time before people come on who never played the original and complain it's not like Battlefield or CoD. It shows the sad state of affairs when these two games dictate how an FPS should play to an entire generation of gamers.

Battlefield's from 2002 as well, numbskull. You can't weasel your way out of this by using popular soundbites.

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This thread is priceless. This guy is obviously, like others have said, a spoiled brat gamer who doesn't belong here. We welcome you to return to COD.

How old are you? When did I in this entire thread say that I like COD? If you believe I am spoiled, why do you believe that and what are your arguments for it? I never said anything offensive to you to cause this hostility, you can keep your opinion, but don't turn this into a flame thread.

If anything this game is more similar to COD and BF and that is the reason I DO NOT like it. My initial post was formed because I believed this game not to aim for the arcady style, but for more realistic strategy/fps mix. You people showed me it was not the goal of the game so my suggestions no longer matter.

So no point in continuing this talk since it will turn into a flame war, if you don't have constructive criticism to post instead of just calling me a COD/BF fanboy (I don't really see where you got this from) and a spoiled brat (?) then don't post anymore and go play the game.

We all have different tastes, no need to cause a fkin flame war because of it.

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  • Moderator
When I watched the trailer this looked like a promising game. But, in it's current state I am disappointed with it and while it would be become awesome if some of the things I'm going to list now would change, I highly doubt they will since I've never seen developers listen to feedback and really change something without sticking to their point of view.

Bear in mind that this point of view comes from a new player.

1. The movement speed of infantry units is too fast. It simply feels like a run and gun game, instead of a tactical team based game. You constantly see players hopping around running and shooting which breaks the immersion and makes me think this game isn't serious at all.

Solution

-Reduce the sprint speed by 15%, and normal movement speed by 5%

2. As an infantry player I feel like I don't have a goal.

Solution:

- Does a commander unit exist? If so give him the option to set waypoints for infantry players and vehicles. Those waypoints would show on the infantry players screen and they would have a goal to complete.

3. Higher tier infantry units are personalized and have names and on top of that they aren't limited to 1 per faction so you see a lot of clones hopping around the battlefield which breaks immersion.

4. TTK is too high. So far every game I know that had a low TTK was more tactical, simply because players weren't so encouraged to leave cover because they would get shot faster. It encouraged teamplay.

5. Give the players incentive to move together. Add the ability to form squads, and if the squad moves in an area of 10 meters from one another they would receive bigger rewards as the result.

6. Remove the horrible kill sound or make it optional, I know it's sacred to some of ya but it simply ruins immersion.

I can't stress enough how immersion is important in contributing towards the success of the game.

I will leave this game now, and hopefully if these things get fixed I'll return. I wish the developers luck and I really hope you listen to these suggestion because this game has enormous potential. Good luck!

-I would hope you would return if just the speed thing, if it is changed. That is one of few reasonable arguements here. I could agree if it were decided to lower footspeed a bit, but it was TOO slow in Renegade Classic so that infantry buff is a good thing.

-You have a goal, kill the other player's base. Harder to do it alone, best to coordinate with other players. Generally, that takes one's own communication ability, but it's not impossible. In Renegade classic, one would take their own incentive to repair teammate vehicles so the armor can shell the base, or ask for a tank to drive in range of enemy base defence so an infantry can run out to a building and c4 it or clear the repair guys so the tanks kill it (you can run faster too). THAT BEING SAID, you also have q button to coordinate team attacks too.

-Ever play Team Fortress 2? This isn't a gamebreaking bug. This is a design choice. This will never be call of duty. Changing something like this pretty much says "I have no interest in making Renegade or a unique game, I want a military shooter clone!" HOWEVER, although it is a waste of dev time, it would be neat to have costumes for characters, the oldschools and then some that maybe you can unlock with in-game achievements like kills with guns collected over your time playing and unlock simple skins like generic soldier skins and stuff. HOWEVER, the current skins are tale-tale and let you see what your getting shot by when you see the enemy and new skins would mean one has to actually read the red square to make sure so it is a simplicity issue.

-TTK means health per damage ratio? That also is a design influenced directly from Renegade. Generally, you have to chew gunfights out when it comes auto-vs-auto, but with ADS and pecking weapons one can "kite" cover, meaning running backwards following a corner in and out. Generally, there are repair units who can heal infantry, if you don't get a kill don't worry as long as you don't die and if you are hurt quickly run to base and refill or go to the "cavalry" and get a heal from them in-field.

-You don't get much done without others. However, since there are a lot of Renegade veterans as well as older gamers, you can usually find people more than happy to do as asked to help. Ask for a repair, I will usually change to technician and literally get in with you, I am happy to spend the next 35min to repair, or if I have a vehicle and you ask to distract guard tower, I will drive right out in front of it and make an arse out myself to get you in the base. BUT I THINK giving players kill assists, suppression assists, and making them pop up on screen for the "fuzzy" feeling that they "contributed" would be dangling a turkey leg while be fun to collect those bonuses.

-I think the boink sound should be optional. However, I leave it on, I like getting notification for a kill, not to mention the euphoric response that follows. Ever watch TobyGames play Happy Wheels? Some levels he gets so stressed and worked up over not getting a do-do-do at the last second or the level not ending in a do-do-do, he has an unhealthy dependency to the euphoric response of the win sound and if deprived he will redo an entire level for 15 minutes plus or quit and intentionally choose a level he can beat easily.

There are other problems you didn't even state here brah. I just hope, since this is beta and a game freely made and distributed by a generous developer team in their spare time, you at least give it a look every patch. However, I appreciate your feedback and agree on a few quality of life changes you mentioned.

PS: There is no need for hostility, I agree.

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Man i dont get this, the developers spent years and lots of man hours to give you this game as a FREE game its FREE, sure its your own opinion and all that but its FREE you didnt pay anything, you didnt lose anything but maybe a couple of hours to play. Its simple really you dont like the game thats really good and its all fine just dont play, others will be playing this game as long as its alive and kicking.

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We all have different tastes, no need to cause a fkin flame war because of it.

You started the Flame war when you gave the post this title: Impressions from a new player and why I think the game sucks

No, it was everyone else being overly defensive morons. The OP was pretty polite even if frustrated. I have little problem with the wall of text above, since it didn't devolve into "LOL COD; BF"

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We all have different tastes, no need to cause a fkin flame war because of it.

You started the Flame war when you gave the post this title: Impressions from a new player and why I think the game sucks

Pretty much the case to be honest. Somehow you may give the impresssion of "I'm new here, I don't know "your" game, but it's just bullshit. I don't like it. You shouldn't either." with the title.

Ontopic itself:

The only thing that is pretty arcadey in it's own are infantry-fights [Which is one of the main aspects of the game, ofc.]. Infantry has a lot of power in this game and that is in my opinion a good thing. You are at any point in the game a "man-in-the-middle", being able to do the difference. It's different to BF or CoD (and great in my opinion.)

BUT, and that's the case atm... one of the points why it feels arcadey at the moment is that the advantages of different classes aren't yet known to most of the people. They may not know that an engineer is been able to plant mines, plant remote C4's to kill enemy infantry... or that a Sakura is useful as Sniper... And it's possible to kill a Sakura (which costs 1000$) as a rifle soldier. That's what I've always admired in Ren and here. It may feel arcardey, but that's actually kind of a balance thingie.

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It may feel arcardey, but that's actually kind of a balance thingie..

Is there, then, inherent value in balance?

In this case it is. I may provide an example if you've ever played Renegade and one of it's mods. IF there's just ONE really overpowered unit (as the Havoc/Sakura may have been called in vanilla Ren) it kills the fun. And that's not the case in RenX in my opinion.

Edit: It may actually possible to decrease the weapon damage in every case/increase the health of every unit to slow down the gameplay, but that may have various side effects.

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It may feel arcardey, but that's actually kind of a balance thingie..

Is there, then, inherent value in balance?

In this case it is. I may provide an example if you've ever played Renegade and one of it's mods. IF there's just ONE really overpowered unit (as the Havoc/Sakura may have been called in vanilla Ren) it kills the fun. And that's not the case in RenX in my opinion.

I'm afraid I haven't. I think right now the infantry in Ren:X kind of blurs together (everything feels UP) and the game really could do with a slightly slower pace. That's all I can think of for now.

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As I've said. The only thing that actually has this "fast-paced"- gameplayfeeling feeling to it is infantry. And it may be possible that it may get slowed down (a bit). Remember, it's just an open Beta. Even the first version.

Well, so do the vehicles, but it's really no worse than Planetside 2 and I'm not exactly expecting another ARMA.

I do hope it gets slowed down and some of the weapons buffed just to make them feel less 'floaty'.

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When you remake a game from 2002 it's only a matter of time before people come on who never played the original and complain it's not like Battlefield or CoD. It shows the sad state of affairs when these two games dictate how an FPS should play to an entire generation of gamers.

This.

This isn't a realistic FPS, either, by the way, so people that don't like it, deal with it.

Or go back to Planetside 2, which is a ridiculously bad game.

I'll not have my favorite game that actually has some arcade flavor be ruined by the more realistic military games that are all so completely terrible.

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Little disappointed by the backlash here peeps... input from players new to the game is especially valuable because it challenges things you take for granted.

By having criticism on Ren(X) you do not immediately wish it to be exactly like BF or CoD.... similarly when playing BF I see everyone telling everyone to "go play CoD", this behaviour leads to nothing.

So try to discuss it in a mature fashion yeah?

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Sadly I've been trying to get people who never play'd the old renegade when i did to join in on both Ren and RenX and they all give up after a few hours because they don't like it, mainly because they don't understand the game mechanics and never experienced the awesome game you can have on marathon with balanced and well communicating teams.

It's going to be hard to change this as most people now days just give it a first try and go meh, i don't get/like/understand this and pick a, dare i say, easier game to play.

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He's requesting edits to the core gameplay mechanics because they aren't what he's used to, and in doing so saying the game "sucks." That's not critique. That's not criticism. That's posting looking for an argument or fight.

That's trolling. Trolling the trolls makes them return to their troll homes.

So, thedude, 1v1 Sims?

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He's requesting edits to the core gameplay mechanics because they aren't what he's used to, and in doing so saying the game "sucks." That's not critique. That's not criticism. That's posting looking for an argument or fight.

That's trolling. Trolling the trolls makes them return to their troll homes.

So, thedude, 1v1 Sims?

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