yosh56

Decided to post another part of the guide that can stand all by itself easily. This one's a bit crazier, but also kind of entertaining. ----- Creative Tactics ----- Renegade is a game that rewards creativity to the fullest degree, and several new additions/accidental additions allow for a greater degree of creativity than OldRen ever did. "Physics" ------- I use the term loosely, as I've never seen a 4 ton land vehicle be the same after an 80 ton hunk of steel landed on top of it. For the sake of RenX though, these are the more creative (and actually useful) ways you can exploit the new...'physics'. -Ground Vehicle Surfing by Infantry- Probably one of the first things discovered, ground vehicle surfing got some mixed reviews, but overall Im fairly certain it's around to stay. There's actually a lot it can add to the game when used correctly. -APC battle-platforms In Battlefield there are several vehicles that allow infantry to shoot their weapons out of them, yet we don't have that functionality in Renegade, and honestly it doesn't ever need to see the light of day (MAYBE for transport helicopters). However, with the UDK's weird physics engine, we now have the ability to put infantry in and ON an APC. They're still vulnerable to splash damage, but if the APC driver plays their cards right, they can be the most devastating weapon on the field. 3-5 infantry can sit and crouch atop an APC, and so long as they don't move too much they can ride along just fine. Team-Independent: +PICs/Railguns on an APC. Sure, it's expensive, but truly stop and think about the main thing that stops PICs from stopping vehicles. It's vehicle's ability to run away before they die. Throw 4 PICs atop an APC and you now have an Obelisk that is extremely mobile, can fire over vehicles, and if the splash damage gets too heavy, the PICs can just jump in the APC and go refill. +Mobius/Mendoza on an APC. This one's the most high-risk high-reward. The driver for the APC has to get close to allow Mobius to do damage, however having 4 Mobius' on top means that 320DPS can now melt vehicles AND sprint at the same time. +Rocket Soldiers on APCs. This one is a bit of a mixed bag, but it is a lot cheaper than the others. This basically allows for Nod to circumvent not having a cheap AA vehicle, and GDI can have a better AA/AT vehicle just by using a little cooperation. 4 rocket soldiers on an APC have more range than an MRLS, can travel much faster, and if all 4 focus fire they can down aircraft in 2 volleys. Couple that with being able to output 220 armour damage with a full hit, and you actually have a cheap anti-armour platform that's faster than any tank in the game on top of having nearly infinite range. +Havoc/Sakura squad on APCs: This requires the infantry on top to be decent shots, and is a little too specific to be much of any use outside of anti-air and anti-light armour. However, when it comes to AA and destroying light vehicles, this is an amazing combo. You can chase down air vehicles thanks to the APC's speed, and if the snipers on top can aim while moving then you're capable of kiting air vehicles and artillery as well. If you know a group that wants to completely wipe the skies clean of air vehicles, then this is likely the best, if not most expensive choice. Actually, between 5 people, it isn't even that expensive. You can basically think of this tactic as the closest thing to the General's Quad-Cannon that we're ever going to get. GDI-Specific: +Gunners on an APC. Throw Gunners on top of an APC and you basically have a mobile Gunner rush. You can only fit about 4-5 comfortably, so it's not the most effectively tactic, but it will allow the Gunners just enough extra elevation to shoot over obstacles they originally couldn't. If you want to push it, you can drive slowly and try to fit 6 on the roof. That's still enough to down a building in two magazines. +Patches on an APC. Remember how talked up Patch rushes were at some point on this guide? Well, here it comes again. 1 Patch is perfectly capable of dishing out 48 DPS to vehicles when perfectly aiming. 4 Patches can dish out 192 DPS. Factor this in with the fact that Patch has greater range than the Volt rifle, and his weapon has some large, psychologically disturbing tracers, and you've got a weapon to strike fear into virtually all enemies. Add in the mobility of the APC, and now it's a terrifying weapon that's difficult to hit at range, and can run before it dies. Nod-Specific: +LCG Blackhands on APCs: These work much the same as Patch except for some noticeable differences. For one, their weapon does less DPS than Patch's, but on the opposite side of that it is more accurate straight from the hip. Secondly, and most important of all, their projectile is instantaneous, meaning if you can aim at it, you will hit it. 4 of these firing upon one target accounts for about 160 DPS, and if you can continue moving whilst pulling off that damage, you can successfully down most GDI vehicles in no time. As an added bonus, the LCG is phenomenal against infantry. +SBHs on APCs: Their weapons aren't nearly as impressive against vehicles as the LCG, and having a smaller magazine makes them better suited for hit-and-run manoeuvres than anything else. On the bright side, nobody will know there's anything amiss until everyone starts firing. -Humvee/Buggy battle platforms +While they don't have the armour required to tank damage, or the space to fit more than 1 or 2 passengers comfortably on top, the Humvee (and to a lesser extent the Buggy), can be used much the same as an APC battle-platform. +Faster speeds make these good hit-and-run variants of the APC variants. +The 50 .cal gun alone can cancel out 3/4 of a Technician's repair rate on light vehicles, allowing infantry on top to virtually be able to ignore the repair rate against vehicles they attack. +On the down side, Humvees/Buggies only hold 1 passenger. If you have 2 half-dead infantry on your roof, only one can survive. -Tank Repair Drones (GDI) +The Technician classes can already repair tanks quite easily, but GDI's can take advantage of the shape of their tanks to allow Hotwires to ride safely on the back of tanks whilst repairing. +Crouching down on the back of the Med or Mammoth allows them to continue moving forward at full speed if necessary. +Thanks to the size of GDI's two Main tanks, you can sit comfortably far back enough to avoid most splash damage from the front whilst repairing. Unfortunately, splash damage from the sides and air are still an issue. -Air-Vehicle Surfing- This may or may not stick around, but I hope that it does and that the issue of in-flight repairs being too strong is addressed instead. However, since it still works in beta 3 here's a guide to everything you have or haven't been doing by surfing on air units. -Orca/Apache surfing This is notorious enough not to even have to talk about. I'll run down a few good combinations anyway. It is imperative to note that infantry on small aircraft do take extensive splash damage however. +Techs/Engineers on aircraft: Possibly rated one of the most annoying tactics in game, a Technician class on an airframe makes it virtually impossible to defeat without extensive fire. The repair rate is rather insane vs. most AA weapons, though several well-placed missiles does do in the infantry on top. +Rocket soldier on aircraft: Rocket soldiers are decent Anti-air in RenX, though firing from the ground means they can have aircraft targets duck behind high objects to block incoming missiles. So comes the rocket soldier on top of the an Orca/Apache. Dogfighting between aircraft comes down to short range bursts of high damage usually. With a rocket soldier around however, aircraft can have their little passenger pick away at an incoming target's health long before they are in range of aircraft weapons. This also allows for picking off of half-dead opponents that try to flee. +PICs/Ravs on aircraft: PICs are a devastating force to being with, but on top of an airframe they aid in a variety of ways. They can pick off other airframes from greater distance than aircraft weapons helping to soften targets before their pilot moves in for the kill, or they can melt fleeing targets once they are below a quarter of their health. On top of this, PICs are able to aid in anti ground vehicle operations, as they work very much the same as aircraft in terms of firepower: lots of damage in a short time, but quite a delay between shots. +Havocs/Sakuras on aircraft: If you literally can not dogfight to save your life, get a 1k sniper to stand on your airframe and watch every other aircraft pull a quick 180 the moment they spot you. 1k snipers can pick away over half of an aircraft's health, and if the craft literally can not break line of sight then they are as good as dead. Couple this with now having an instant projectile with infinite range, and the skies are more or less yours. +Volt Rifles on Aircraft: Volt rifles are fairly short-ranged; aircraft are fairly short ranged. Volt rifles can take out ALL of an aircraft's health in one magazine. If your pilot is able to keep you safe from rocket barrages and splash damage, you together literally have a time to kill vs. other aircraft that is faster than they can turn around a run for the hills. You also do not have to have perfect aim with the volt rifle, as you would with one-shot weapons. Because of how quickly they get rid of their damaging ammo, Volt rifles also make for very powerful strafing runs vs. ground targets, allowing aircraft to get in, do their damage and get out. -Flying Coffin Surfing (Transport Helicopter surfing) Oh, Trannies might kind of suck at their main job, but their large backside, ability to fly, and ability to carry people actually makes them the successor to the APC in TWO ways now. -The Flying Battleship +Like APCs, the Tranny can carry infantry on top of itself. There are a few differences however. The Tranny is longer and can hold more people on its roof, but very abrupt motions by the pilot can throw people off. However...it can FLY. On that note however, the Tranny needs to turn perpendicular to the target that infantry want to fire at for maximum effect. +Anti-Air Battleships: Ever wonder how easy it is to completely free the skies from annoying aircraft? It's this easy. *4+ Rocket soldiers on top of a transport have infinite range, a locking projectile, and can be flown to maximum height so that their threat range is outright ridiculous. On a map like Walls or Whiteout, this means you can create a AAM site in your base, and make the plateau a no-fly zone whilst still inside your base. *4+ Havocs/Sakuras can also be used if your team has money. At max height over a base, 4 Havocs can turn the entire visible map into a no-fly zone, thanks to an instant projectile with basically infinite range. It's not a SAM site, it's something much much worse. +Anti-Vehicle Battleships: Have an armour problem? Look no further than creating a flying tank destroyer. Team-independent: *4-6 rocket soldiers are outright devastating to vehicles and aircraft on foot. Allow them to be capable of flight, and suddenly any and all tanks on the enemy team are just a few annoying shots away from death. Couple this with helicopters being able to fly over a tank turret's threat range, and you have a recipe for disaster. *5 PICS\Ravs on a Transport helicopter is the the equivalent of a giant flying Obelisk, except for the fact that they shoot faster, AND do more damage. While PICs don't have the infinite range of rockets, they do have enough range for the chopper to fly high enough to avoid a good chunk of ground fire. Couple this with 5 PICs delving out 425 damage every 3 or so seconds, and it becomes clear that this battleship can clear the field of Artillery and heavy tanks with ease. It's also not half bad at warding off incoming aircraft, assuming the PICs can aim. *Volt Rifles are a mixed review for battleships. On one hand, the damage that 5 or 6 can output is utterly game-breaking, able to melt Meds and Flame tanks in only about 2 seconds. There is however, the problem with range, and the Volt rifle's short range forces it to bring the helicopter into dangerously low airspace. GDI: *Gunners are decent anti-vehicle from the skies, raining down rockets with reckless abandon. Honestly he is better saved for the next class of flying battleship. *Patch makes for quite an anti-matter battleship, though his slow projectiles make aiming difficult if lots of movement is involved. However, if performing hit and runs with stopping along the way, he is able to perform phenomenally at destroying vehicles, thanks to 5 of him being able to output enough DPS to kill vehicles in mere seconds. Nod: *LCG Black hands have quite an advantage here. They might have lower DPS than Patch, but they also have a projectile that is instant and much easier to aim. *SBHs are not prime for their vehicle killing abilities, but there is a WTF factor involved with a seemingly normal Transport chopper suddenly firing a hail of lasers. They aren't exactly bad at destroying vehicles when there are about 5 of them, but other infantry are just better at it. -Anti-structure Battleships: These are few and far between, but they are also probably one of the best uses imaginable for Transport helicopters. Team-Independent: +6 Rocket soldiers on top of a Tranny. This spells death to all aircraft, most vehicles and can be a real pain in the ass against structures. They do significant damage, and it is most important to note that they can exploit the flying abilities of the aircraft to target an enemy base from just about anywhere they can see it on the map. +Mobius/Mendoza runs require you to get close, but the damage offered is quite possibly the best in game. 6 of them on top of a flying coffin is capable of delving out 60% to a building in 5 seconds, whilst still continuing to fly by. These would be good hit-and-run base destroyers if Transports weren't huge, fat and too slow to survive close range fire fights. GDI: +You knew it was coming. The Gunner rush from on top of a Chinook helicopter. This is likely the most overpowered tactic GDI could ever pull, but only if a good half of a team commits to it. Flying to maximum height in many maps allows line of sight to much of the enemy base, especially since Nod has the Hand of Nod with its huge handy target. Have 6 Gunners on one chopper, line up a shot from an awkward place on the map, then watch Nod freak out as they're Gunner rushed above the silo on Whiteout, or the AIrstrip side of Walls, or even just having their Refinery hit from the field on Lakeside. Nod: +In all honesty, the LCG Black hand isn't too much special against buildings. He's worth a try, but Nod is better off using Mendozas or rocket soldiers for anti-structure battleships. -Vehicle Stacking- Believe it or not, vehicle stacking is actually more of a waste of time than anything else in most cases. It's almost pointless for Nod, and for GDI it can usually be passed off as just something silly. However, there are actually some beneficial combinations on GDI. Nod sadly doesn't have the Mammoth, so many of its vehicle stacks are more counter-productive than anything else. -Mammoth Stacks- (The Overlord) On many maps, throwing vehicles on top of a Mammoth is outright stupid and pointless aside from just doing it to do it. On the other hand, I've actually proven several combinations effective because they actually HELP a lot with one of GDI's main issue on smaller maps. -MRLS on top of Mammoth +For the sheer sake of being able to turn the Mammoth into an Anti Air powerhouse, this combination has a small hint of utility. It is however, quite terrible, as the MRLS's light armour will make it very difficult to keep alive against the heavy weapons thrown at a Mammoth, even with repairs. -Med on a Mammoth +In all my time playing this was the one TRULY beneficial combination GDI had when it came to vehicles stacking. +The Medium tank is narrow enough to sit in between the Mammoth's missile launchers as not to block them (unless the Mammoth has to fire too far sideways.) +A Medium tank has enough heavy armour to not be utterly decimated by enemy fire, ESPECIALLY if Hotwire support is smart enough to repair both tanks. +Most important of all is the fact that this combination solves a glaring issue with GDI on small maps. It is very difficult for Meds and Mammoths to share the field when space is limited. Stacking them atop one another actually allows your team to squeeze more armour into a tighter area, which leads to the last point. +The Med and the Mammoth create the most generic 'I can beat anything on the ground' unit in the game. The Medium tank puts out 64 damage to armour per hit, while a Mammoth's two round burst puts up 128 damage when it connects. With missiles this tallies up to a good 200ish damage from a unit that only takes up the footprint of a single Mammoth. Factor in that the Med reloads a good half-second before the Mammoth, and the damage output of these two units together is actually quite impressive. Parachutes ------ Parachutes were something new that honestly no one really complained about, and it's unlikely that anyone will unless they see anything below used. It seems simple enough as a mechanic, right up until you let a malicious mind have at it and turn the parachute into a new art of war. They messed up the moment they let you shoot while gliding. -Parachute rushing from Transport helicopters Once more the flying coffin has a purpose. If the enemy team isn't extremely sniper heavy you can pull off some very neat stunts to kill off enemy bases. Parachute Gunner Rushing *2 Transport helicopters filled with Gunners can fly at nearly max height over an enemy base, then Para drop said Gunners over a building of their choosing. *Gunners can shoot while parachuting, meaning that a group of 6-8 can rain down fire from the sky at increasingly close range, and they need but get the 1st magazine off before hitting the ground, the second can come after landing. *Parachuting makes you exceptionally difficult to target, meaning it won't be hard to get your rockets off so long as you have hang time. *Gunner's range means that he can switch targets mid-air at any moment. +Mobius/Mendoza parachute rushing *8 Mendozas or Mobius falling from the sky is more or less the lightning apocalypse. *Once in range of a building, the whole of the group can knock off 80% of a building's health in seconds while still airborne. If you're lucky you can also reload before hitting the ground, allowing a potential building kill before you ever touch the ground. *If the pilots have Volt-Rifles as well, they can sacrifice the transports and hop out as well. 10 flying Volt rifles kill any building they want in 5 seconds. *Tall structures like the a Refinery and Hand of Nod are most susceptible. +Engineer Parachute Bombing *Remember hearing about how C4 on the outside of a building is deadly? Right, how about C4 dropped from the sky? *Watch where you throw C4 while parachuting down. If it lands on spots where no one could EVER disarm it, it is a definite kick able offence. *8 Engineers can drop 80% worth of timed C4 damage on top of any building they float over. Drop both remotes to get an instant 80% from remotes alone. *Nod's Airstrip is particularly vulnerable to this, as putting C4 anywhere on the strip is enough to cause damage. Miscellaneous -------- The Stank can be used like a ramp to catapult vehicles over it. Play your cards right and you can jump over the low part of the walls on Walls. Likely TBC

Noticed that no one really exploits this, but during the ModDB podcast I believe, you can plant beacons in the Whiteout tunnel to kill vehicles on the hill. Pretty handy way for GDI to clear arts, if not a bit expensive. Just the more ya' know.

Devs can't make money off of it, so I'd call it good. I'd wait for one of them to give a definite answer though.

Just to poke at this, if 3 Meds lost to a Flamer at ANY range, you've got worse issues than the Flametank's balance. Also, Mammoth+Hoty beats a Flametank unless the Mammoth is also taking damage from other sources. Now not that I want to promote exploiting physics in RenX or anything, but Meds have like a 50+% chance of just running right up to Flametanks, ramming them, and putting them at too awkward of an angle to actually hit the Med. If this was Islands, well then that's literally just Flametank territory. Tight spaces and corners just kind of cater to them, but backing away from them still isn't that much of an issue.

I posted that to basically say that you just gave an answer to half of the issues with the game as is. Basically stating that everyone could literally stop posting on the thread because we have the one true answer to all problems. And it won't be till like February till I'm around to making a tutorial video. As for building a tutorial map, I do believe someone had a good idea in kind of mimicking the OldRen tutorial, but obviously focusing on teaching multiplayer. Obviously I'm not a dev, but A)hopefully when I'm back with a computer I'll be able to work with a few mutator ideas running around my head B) Make a video out of the guide that I wrote/am still writing. C) Write out an outline of how a tutorial level for Renegade X should go.

Actually, if I read that right! it would be a hack. He said he went to 100% while being shot at, and if it wasn't a crate that the Mendoza backed up into then that would most definitely be a hack.

Defending is actually pretty easy. It's just most people don't want to do it. Honestly it can get boring depending on what the enemy does. Sticking one person in each building would pretty much stop all sneaky techs/hotties. You would also be able to call out ion/nuke positions instantly. If any sbh rushes tried to happen, you could just spam for help while throwing remotes and refilling. Based on current server sizes, that's 3-4 out of 20 players on a team. That's like nothing. Mostly all the others could go on offense as long as they understood to suicide/help out if something happened. Well, lots of things work in this game but just require people to do them and coordinate. I agree that losing the ref early is game ending. The other buildings you can deal with somewhat, but early ref loss is just terrible. Nothing like seeing your credits stuck around 350 when the ref dies. That's what I said. It doesn't take nearly as many people to defend as people make it out to. Dunno, Ref dying early is sort of the equivalent of having an idiot feeding right off the bat in LoL, it's going to put you behind a lot. It's unfortunate, but you can come back from it. The silo helps, but obviously it isn't on every map. --- Honestly, I've seen too many things work to agree with some mechanics issues. Adapting to availability of resources isn't really present in any other FPSs out there. The closest thing would be Planetside 2, but if you literally do not use vehicles you're barely affected by it, and replacing infantry points is usually fast enough that you'll barely notice them. If you do notice, you literally just wait 10 minutes and all is well. Adore the game to death, but half of the time many of its mechanics just become novelties instead of real game-changers. Not much in Renegade really goes down as a novelty, and that's one reason you actually NOTICE when you lose things. The way I'm seeing it, if we continue down this road we're about to end up taking the Battlefield route and splitting Renegade into Soft/Hardcore servers.

So basically the same as OldRen. Walk em and you can take out damn near a whole door by yourself. I think the sprint key makes people forget these things. Like I said, I rarely disarm all mines as a Hotwire. Just need to get rid of 2/5 to walk into a building, no real need to use a wall, but it does help to limit your movement.

Just stop right there. Needn't even say more.

I'm actually fairly certain that the Refinery and Powerplant are ALWAYS the first things targeted by early rushes. I'll bet money on it. Reason for Nod teams losing after the HON is down probably has more to do with nobody actually knowing how to play Nod beyond SBHs and nukes. Nod's probably going to lose the moment GDI gets decent defenders. In reality, Nod's more cost-effective in the field than GDI is, but it requires the SLIGHTEST coordination to use Techs and Arts together, and when I say SLIGHTEST I mean you just have to randomly be in the same area. Bloody hell, it takes 3-4 people to completely lock down a base. That leaves 4/5-3/4 of the team or more to do other things. High player count servers generally didn't come about till later in Ren's life, and they only got really popular when the community started dying off so they weren't he only freakin servers with people on them when you'd log in. Gotta change my vote to sit with vlad on this one. 'lotta ideas, but perpetual stalemates seem inbound. As if they weren't already an issue. As for the inefficiency of mines, I'm fairly certain there's more topics on this board to counter that argument than support it.

You rant as though using ADS helps you that much. All it's really good for is firing at a distance. Your accuracy when firing at the hip is still so far beyond adequate that using ADS is a joke for most situations. Try using it in a tunnel fight and watch your health drop. Again, they added ADS and recoil, but they also check and balanced themselves to make sure you can basically still play RenX just like OldRen. I can still switch between both games and feel virtually the same in terms of infantry fights, minus the sudden jerking motions in OldRen.

Indeed. My only complaint is losing rocket soldiers, as there is no decent free AA. Toss in a buyable weapon good against light vehicles and I feel like we could solve most issues. Stalemates basically occur from players pretending that lone-wolfing is still an option after losing half of your base. Infantry wars are actually pretty intense. Had a round of Islands with just HON vs. Bar, but no money. You'd be amazed how constantly rushing in groups from both tunnel exits and the front can make you forget how much you don't have. Eventually even own with GDI with bringing all of Nod's attention to the tunnels whilst we just ran into the front. That entire time one person on GDI was calling it a stalemate, attempting to vote the map, and thought throwing timed C4 on the outside of the HON was useless. In short, while we all adapted, made money, and made progress towards an eventual victory, he made the game boring for himself. Again...people make stalemates, not necessarily the game. Even the AGT isn't unbeatable vs. actual groups of infantry. (Also think people are afraid of death crates too much. Death crate % should probably drop to 0 when both vehicle and infantry buildings are destroyed. It already raises the % for certain crates when buildings go down, so it's a system that's already implemented.)

Don't need to park an APC anywhere. Literally just having traffic back there is usually enough to stop most nonsense, unless it's a group of people. Also, 'the mouth of the cave' can be A LOT of things. If it was behind that rock by the Bar then that's perfectly normal.

Not sure how it hinders automatics anymore than random spread, which is how OldRen did it. If anything at least it makes sense that you missed, as opposed to missing because of a dice roll. 'Sides, automatics aren't that bad beside single shot weapons (ignoring n00bjet vs. free infantry), the mass of complaints about the Carbine is proof enough to that. Maybe at long range...but then again none of the automatics are built to do long range super effectively. Also, since they went ahead and added ADS that basically gives you 100% accuracy, at least they were smart enough to add some form of counterweight so that all weapons couldn't be used to full effectiveness as moderately long range sniper rifles. OldRen just did that by not having any way to affect your accuracy.

...they barely do. There's less recoil added here than COD, and that's hard to do. It's just enough to make them 'feel' and not really fuck with your aim, especially after the last beta update.

^Seconded. Not like beacons have some insane blast radius, beacon still has to be pretty damn close to the Bar

...Shouldn't parachutes not be infinite? Shouldn't lasers that powerful be invisible? Shouldn't nukes wipe out entire bases? ...you get where this is going I hope.

I just checked out of curiosity. Patch is actually decent against buildings too. Roughly 8% per magazine or 14% if shooting mct. Gonna start organizing Patch rushes. Maybe even mixed rushes of Patch and Gunner. That sounds terrifying. But let's all remember, the SBH is OP. I mention this somewhere in the guide, but when it happens to be fully coordinated GDI vs. fully coordinated Nod, it becomes obvious that GDI not only works 'better' from coordination, but they benefit from it more so than Nod in the end, just due to raw damage output from tanks and infantry. One person can shut down a small trickle of SBHs filtering into the front of your base. One person camping does not stop 5+ Gunners or Patches strolling in. I mean, C4 hurts, but unless they get the entire group, they're pretty boned.

See so much variety from...being able to clear mines faster as a Hotwire, still carry a carbine (maps with high eco 350 is chump-change), and be able to solo a building? Dunno, but I think this does less to help and more to exacerbate the issue. Great, so I could be a Rocket soldier, or Officer and disarm mines slowly for 500 credits with a semi-decent weapon, or just wait for 200 extra to disarm mines way faster, be able to solo a building and carry an automatic weapon. Think I'll go with the latter...every single time. Weak repair gun under weapons tab isn't a terribly bad idea, but eating away mine health makes Techs even more useful than they already are. Also, SBHs would probably still just walk mines. It's a lot faster if you have even just 2 people.

Ran a copious amount of boring math on reloads and distances and such. *hands you a victory cookie* Also edited the guide for it.

This isn't a problem with the armors. This is a problem with the sheer numbers of the game. Someone didn't do math when balancing characters and some ended up with unuseable dps. The hung is, Patch's weapon was designed with being 'kinda good at everything' in mind. It's fine for it to just barely out do a repair gun, as he costs more than a Tech anyway. Gunner's damage to heavy vehicles is alright as is, for he does at least cost less than all heavy vehicles. The issue is that Gunner hitting a buggy with a rocket vs. a Stank with a rocket doesn't make much sense to have the same damage be dealt, especially when you look at what a repair gun can do. Gunner doesn't really need to be a godly answer to higher tier armour, as Patch loses much of his extra damage when he reloads anyway. What Gunner could benefit from, is actually doing slightly more to light armour to make it seem like he's actually a tier 2 anti-vehicle solution. Goes for pretty much all anti-vehicle weapons that do the same damage to heavy and Light.

Indeed, I was just referring to the splash damage anyway. I remember the GDI Shotgunners also having an explosion resistance for some reason, but that's just something someone said and I don't know for a fact. Also, the fact that their armour blocked more damage than their health is an interesting concept. Should think about having armour be more a part of the game than just the same as health and bypassed by only Tiberium weaponry.

Sheesh, I could keep this forum alive by my damn self at this rate. This is more of something I noticed and mostly just wanted to ask about, but are there any plans to use Renegade's explosion resistant armours for infantry? I had mentioned it in a topic about mines, but I think it's worth blatantly bringing up in a topic of its own. For those unaware, the Nod FlameThrower and Chem Trooper had 50% damage reduction to explosions. I personally think this is a system that could have gone further and been better suited to other infantry as well, but I'm more concerned with whether or not there are any plans to implement the special armour again (And maybe not even JUST on those two infantry)?

Obviously it's unplayable, 'cuz we all can't play it...

Oddly enough (on the note of Arty-Tech vs. Med-Tech) once they hit a certain number (around 7-8) Meds come out on top both tactically and on pure brute force. It's almost like we should be spamming Meds. You know, the thing I've yelled in every game of Islands ever.