Renerade x will it stay alive ??

[rytlock]

Now i know been spammed about all over the place but this needs to be a high ticket issue the people who made the game i thank you for all your help on getting this great game back to us but i think we need a anit cheat system or a improvement for the hackers I.E a better voting system what dose not take 12 yes and less then 2 no to kick people what most of the time people fail to do so posting there name on this forums is pointless as they rename in 10 secs lol Is there an in game admin powers for servers out to kick people without vote system because the in cress of aim bot people and speed-hacks are increasing in servers and a lot of people and leaving games ass people out there what don't vote was there not a patch out for this at some point

so i guess it all comes down to 3 things

1: anit cheat system like the old renegade what forces you to install to play on servers

2:A patch

3:a new voteing system what takes less votes at least or ingame admins powers as i can't see no admins

Edited April 14, 2014 by Guest

[omega79]

admin and moderators can kick any time, doubt they need to start a vote

but as far as i know you can not make cheaters stay out, there is no way to ban ...

so if someone gets kicked he can rejoin within a few seconds ...

at the moment there is no serial or any kind of nick registration

The comming patch includes some sort of global bans, server probably can enable Steam required

and then ban by the Steam ID ... the only problem is that I can see how this can be abused

But I also think the patch maybe removes some points where the popular hacks do hook on the game

And I am sure, sooner or later there will be a solution ... maybe comming from the community after the gold release

[ARC_trooper]

I just hate the people who do that, if you want to cheat play a fucking skirmish game..

[HaTe]

Anti-cheat is easier said than done...

But countermeasures are being taken. The first patch will not allow cheaters to do certain things that they are currently capable of. It will also make the chat last much longer, and have the voting system completely revamped (so that votes pass easier).

[Havoc89]

We're doing final testing on the first patch, it will either be released today or tomorrow, but most likely today.

An anti-cheat system is a very big task to do right away, and will not be in the first patch or even later patches anytime soon. However we have taken precautionary measures to ensure certain hacks are no longer possible. We have also upgraded the voting system which makes it much easier to pass votes. The change list will be avaliable soon along with the patch which has much more details on what has been done.

We are going to regularly patch the game so the community should not worry about us not supporting it. Over time we will be taking more measures to ensure a smoother experience for you guys.

[HaTe]

Also, if you wish to be proactive in helping out the game, and specifically a community; please apply to be a moderator at a community and actively look for cheaters. That will help keep out cheaters at certain communities, as well as help that community's servers stay active and positive. If you have what it takes, or wish to learn what it takes, please do your part in stopping these people from ruining the game

[Mrcod]

Good to hear some measures are being taken with this first patch. I think an improved vote kick system will go a long way.

[lazy5686]

Server owners can already view player joins including IP's and steam IDs through RCON. They can also execute commands like kick.

It is fairly straight forward to write a simple bot to store banned IPs and IDs...

[H.D. Lovecraft]

Server owners can already view player joins including IP's and steam IDs through RCON. They can also execute commands like kick.

It is fairly straight forward to write a simple bot to store banned IPs and IDs...

There is a problem with banning certain names. Right now anyone can join with any name? What's stopping a hacker from joining with a legitimate player's name in an attempt to get them banned? I've seen this happen on three occasions already, and if bans were enforced by name, this would give hackers even more reason to muck around.

[Havoc89]

The new system we have in place for the patch bans on IP instead of names and stores it in a global ban list so that hackers cant jump servers. If no admin is present, players can vote kick, but they can also trigger a game replay to be stored on the server which admins can look over, find the culprit and ban their IP.

[Evono]

The new system we have in place for the patch bans on IP instead of names and stores it in a global ban list so that hackers cant jump servers. If no admin is present, players can vote kick, but they can also trigger a game replay to be stored on the server which admins can look over, find the culprit and ban their IP.

Ban on IP yey... BULLSHIT.

If someone cheats on lets say 1.2.3.4 and restarts the router ,.

someone else can get the ip 1.2.3.4 from the Provider and what is it then ? someone who didnt cheat cant play till Router restart

+ alot of VPN ips ( Like cyberghost , and different many Game vpns for better ping will fast be banned and all will suffer from it who is using service X + the service itself)

Just get some Machine hash id into the game. let it Generate a ID with the HW configuration and ban this. still alot better as useless ip bans .... ip bans are the same like name bans or just a normal ban 1 click and its unbanned...

Or why dont enable VAC ?

VAC is great a anti cheat it Monitors cheater sometime looks ( like 1-3 weeks ) looks if other people use the same cheat analyse all of them and then ZAP all of them are gone at once. thats because that way no one can test cheats vs anti cheat Programs...

and you use already steam ID for ladder.

[dommafia]

The new system we have in place for the patch bans on IP instead of names and stores it in a global ban list so that hackers cant jump servers. If no admin is present, players can vote kick, but they can also trigger a game replay to be stored on the server which admins can look over, find the culprit and ban their IP.

Ban on IP yey... BULLSHIT.

If someone cheats on lets say 1.2.3.4 and restarts the router ,.

someone else can get the ip 1.2.3.4 from the Provider and what is it then ? someone who didnt cheat cant play till Router restart

+ alot of VPN ips ( Like cyberghost , and different many Game vpns for better ping will fast be banned and all will suffer from it who is using service X + the service itself)

Just get some Machine hash id into the game. let it Generate a ID with the HW configuration and ban this. still alot better as useless ip bans .... ip bans are the same like name bans or just a normal ban 1 click and its unbanned...

Or why dont enable VAC ?

VAC is great a anti cheat it Monitors cheater sometime looks ( like 1-3 weeks ) looks if other people use the same cheat analyse all of them and then ZAP all of them are gone at once. thats because that way no one can test cheats vs anti cheat Programs...

and you use already steam ID for ladder.

You seem to think all they have to do is press a button to turn VAC on a non steam game...

[HaTe]

You could ban an IP range and then add whitelists to it for certain ip's. That's what many servers were forced to do in renegade before serial hash bans became more efficient.

I do agree though and have been posting for it for a while now that a generated serial hash upon installation would at the very least provide a huge hinderance to cheat evaders. A hardware serial Id scan is apparently another option too, but idk how the legality of that would come into play for a free game (terms of agreement, anyone?).

Steam id is used for ladder, but many people don't connect via steam. Hopefully the final release will be a greenlighted steam release, and so players would be forced to connect with steam. That would, again, slow cheaters down heavily (making them have to make a new steam account and redownload/reinstall the game) if they wished to evade.

[omega79]

i do not like the way how he says it but he got a point there ...

dynamic IP is ver common, specialy in europe ...

I just have to reconnect my router to the internet with a shortcut on my desktop, takes usualy 3-8 seconds

this means if people who are on the same provider than me get banned it could be me suffering from that (if I get the banned IP)

and even VPN is very common among cheaters ...

but even if IP ban is one of the weakest tools against cheaters, it is a start!

A hardware hash is a better way, even if thats not perfect either.

but i have no idea how easy that is to code ...

suggesting VAC at this point is plain rediculus, game is not even approved by valve yet

You could ban an IP range and then add whitelists to it for certain ip's. That's what many servers were forced to do in renegade before serial hash bans became more efficient.

sorry, but that is rubbish .. dynamic ips change a lot, some providers force to disconnect every 24 hours ... every new connect means a new IP

whitelist could be easy done with steam IDs in renegade-X ... much more effective

[SFJake]

I really don't see steam IDs as a deterrent, less effective than IP ban which at least works on some people (I know for instance I only have 1 IP).

I'm assuming the global ban list is proof only, by the way? A system like this is very risky. I've also seen IP range bans just catch people that don't deserve it, and they have to go on forums and ask to be whitelisted which is a bit ridiculous.

You have to be careful not to throw things in there that has chances of hurting people that don't cheat.

[omega79]

global ban system has a high potential for abuse ...

i like the MC bans system for minecraft (even if the MC-Bans staff is somewhat ... i not like them)

every server has a reputation represented by points (ie 10)

every client has a reputation represented by points (ie 10)

if a client got banned from 1 server he gets points subtracted from his reputation

the subtraction does depend on the reputation of the server

every banned client can open a dispute and demand proof

if the client wins he gets his points back and the server loses reputation

if the server wins it can earn extra reputation (to a certain limit), makes its ban more powerfull

the rules are very strict and there are strict definitions of what is proof and what not

there still ways to ban only on the server, not global ... for players not following special server rules

every server can set a minimum reputation a player has to have to join the server

this system clearly needs a lot of work and administration, but it is a decent way to handle

a shared global ban list ...

I still think IP bans are not a good tool to ban cheaters ...

[Evono]

global ban system has a high potential for abuse ...

i like the MC bans system for minecraft (even if the MC-Bans staff is somewhat ... i not like them)

every server has a reputation represented by points (ie 10)

every client has a reputation represented by points (ie 10)

if a client got banned from 1 server he gets points subtracted from his reputation

the subtraction does depend on the reputation of the server

every banned client can open a dispute and demand proof

if the client wins he gets his points back and the server loses reputation

if the server wins it can earn extra reputation (to a certain limit), makes its ban more powerfull

the rules are very strict and there are strict definitions of what is proof and what not

there still ways to ban only on the server, not global ... for players not following special server rules

every server can set a minimum reputation a player has to have to join the server

this system clearly needs a lot of work and administration, but it is a decent way to handle

a shared global ban list ...

I still think IP bans are not a good tool to ban cheaters ...

This sounds Absoulutely nice !

ye i had Global lists because they can get Abused by mad admins....

still the MC way looks very good

and ye IPS banns are Like no banns.... it takes me 3 seconds with a small script at my router ( click on pc ) to change the ip....

and if ever all 50k + ips are banned from my provider i can still change my ip 256 times with different lands and 70 different providers with my vpn.....

[RypeL]

Its obvious that banning by IP is no perfect solution. We are not that dumb! But its the only option we have available right now. We dont want to enforce steam right now so we cant use Steam-ID. And this hardware hash calculation: I bet all those suggesting it have no clue what they are talking about. Everything that is calculated clientside and not backed up by a big system like Steam should be an easy target for hackers. And scanning peoples harddrives to calculate some kind of hash sounds horrible to me. Beeing a free game people might argue that we use RenX as a tool to spy on their PC´s. At the very least when you talk about hardware hash provide a ressource/examples to back it up. But i bet you have no idea what you are talking about. So the only options we have left are IP and Steam-ID. And Steam-ID we only will enforce when we absolutely have to. So right now we have the option to either do nothing or to ban on IP. So we are banning on IP. The plan however is to only globally ban an IP after a demo has proven that someone cheated. I will make a post explaining it more later. Remember that we are a freetime dev team with no funding. Of course we can not have a perfect anti cheat system from the start but of course we want to gradually improve.

[Agent]

Its obvious that banning by IP is no perfect solution. We are not that dumb! But its the only option we have available right now. We dont want to enforce steam right now so we cant use Steam-ID. And this hardware hash calculation: I bet all those suggesting it have no clue what they are talking about. Everything that is calculated clientside and not backed up by a big system like Steam should be an easy target for hackers. And scanning peoples harddrives to calculate some kind of hash sounds horrible to me. Beeing a free game people might argue that we use RenX as a tool to spy on their PC´s. At the very least when you talk about hardware hash provide a ressource/examples to back it up. But i bet you have no idea what you are talking about. So the only options we have left are IP and Steam-ID. And Steam-ID we only will enforce when we absolutely have to. So right now we have the option to either do nothing or to ban on IP. So we are banning on IP. The plan however is to only globally ban an IP after a demo has proven that someone cheated. I will make a post explaining it more later. Remember that we are a freetime dev team with no funding. Of course we can not have a perfect anti cheat system from the start but of course we want to gradually improve.

Although I had suggested getting the serial number of users' drives, I never suggested actually scanning the drive. You can get hardware serials through WMI (for an example, go into command prompt and input "wmic bios get serialnumber"); the only really "tricky" part about it is verifying that the hash goes unmodified by external applications, which can be remedied by encrypting and signing the hash, then verifying the encrypted hash against a central server (which also does the signing). The issue then becomes preventing malicious users from just sending false serials to the central server and generating new, valid hashes. Though not perfect, you could require these hashes to be tied to user accounts (send forum login info on hash calculation). People would be far more skeptical of hack applications when they also ask for user login information, and might choose to avoid it all-together. This would also allow you to ban all of their systems in a single swoop, as well as limit the number of systems for a given user in a given month (very few people would play Renegade X on 10 different systems during the same month). Ban systems could then be adjusted accordingly to forbid IP addresses, hardware hashes, and forum accounts with the use of a single command, which at a minimum would severely complicate the ban-evasion process.

While that idea is still far from perfect, it would certainly demolish most people's attempts to ban-evade by changing their IP address.

Edit:

As for a global ban system, there is some need for consistency for repeat-offenders. If you're banned on 2/3 of the servers for cheating, you might as well go ahead and just get globally banned. That said, there should be very few bans added to such as list; if there's more than 1 or 2 every other week, there might be a problem.

[aca20031]

There are always ways. As an example, St0rm uses a combination of steamid and IP with mask bans. This lets us ban by both steamid and/or IP, but also an IP -range-. If someone changes their IP we can simply ban his ip with a /24 or higher mask. The risk of banning an innocent with such a small range is relatively low if we focus it on region. Theoretically we could analyze existing bans and find if a large number of them correlate to a small range, and translate those to a range ban automatically. I think this is pretty elegant.

[omega79]

@RypeL

Sorry man, I was never intended to make anyone look dumb!

Apologies if that one got the wrong way!

I always thought (and said), since Totem Arts works out of their own pocket and in their spare time, the community should help preventing cheats aswell.

We all know that there some skilled people out there who could help.

Look how quick an alternative launcher was there (I not compare Launcher and AC), that shows passion and potential.

Agent seems to have at least theoretical knowledge about possible solutions.

I am very sure that the DEVS and the COMMUNITY can work something out!

It is still beta and very fresh on the market

Edited March 13, 2014 by Guest

[goztow]

Well, what BIATCH used to do was server side validation of client sent information. For example: the client sends 10 Havoc rifle shots in 1 second. the server knows it should only be able to send 2 per second at the very most. User gets banned for rapid fire. Nod player accesses GDI PT. Server knows this is not possible and bans the player. Same with damage.

It is not calculating the damage server side, but validating that it is possible or not. If it doesn't auto ban, it could spam messagesi n the logs about a possible cheater and let the server owners handle it. I don't say it is easy to implement but it sure as hell is possible.

[RypeL]

Ya We have some checks like that and will add a lot more in the future. We will also make it that if a check detects a possible cheater an automated demorecording will be triggered to catch evidence and we could even automatically send the serveradmin an email if an admin did provide us with an email for his server.

[Methanoid]

Also, if you wish to be proactive in helping out the game, and specifically a community; please apply to be a moderator at a community and actively look for cheaters. That will help keep out cheaters at certain communities, as well as help that community's servers stay active and positive. If you have what it takes, or wish to learn what it takes, please do your part in stopping these people from ruining the game

problem with that is, anyone can be anyone ingame by just changing the name.

[HaTe]

The new patch adds a delay time to bring able to change nicknames. If you're a mod, you also should have access to ip's as well.

[iran]

Well, what BIATCH used to do was server side validation of client sent information. For example: the client sends 10 Havoc rifle shots in 1 second. the server knows it should only be able to send 2 per second at the very most. User gets banned for rapid fire. Nod player accesses GDI PT. Server knows this is not possible and bans the player. Same with damage.

It is not calculating the damage server side, but validating that it is possible or not. If it doesn't auto ban, it could spam messagesi n the logs about a possible cheater and let the server owners handle it. I don't say it is easy to implement but it sure as hell is possible.

BIATCH doesn't catch Rate of Fire/rapid fire hacks and I never heard of it catching Nod players accessing GDI PT (don't think there is such a cheat in Renegade). RGH just has PT everywhere. It might actually have support for Nod player accessing GDI PT, but I'm not sure, it doesn't have a console message for it according to their docs and I've never heard about it.

http://www.blackintel.org/renegade/proj ... lemessages

----

From the other thread...

They could just re-install.

You can generate hardware based IDs, for example a hard drive volume serial number. That's what RenGuard did but I'm not exactly sure what code they used. Might be this WIN32 API function:

GetVolumeInformation MSDN

[Garbonzo]

LOL one in Jelly marathon server atm spamming his twitch.

pretty funny hahaha

[herrstarr[T]]

have to agree with OP, registered purely to make add my opinion, not many active servers and when a hacker joins and isn't dealt with (hardly any active mods for server, seen like 1 or 2 maybe at most), it basically kills the server, Having only 1-3 Active servers(not counting shitty servers with pretend players" or bots as 80% of player count), really sucks, This game is friggin sick and I love playing it, but when hacker just completely kills a server so every1 leaves then GG.

Also when ppl vote fields and every1 leaves, thats also GG.

I'm not a technical wizard like some, but However u do it to prevent hackers it must be done in next few days or this is going to sink and have like 50 ppl playing at any given time max.

[goztow]

Well, what BIATCH used to do was server side validation of client sent information. For example: the client sends 10 Havoc rifle shots in 1 second. the server knows it should only be able to send 2 per second at the very most. User gets banned for rapid fire. Nod player accesses GDI PT. Server knows this is not possible and bans the player. Same with damage.

It is not calculating the damage server side, but validating that it is possible or not. If it doesn't auto ban, it could spam messagesi n the logs about a possible cheater and let the server owners handle it. I don't say it is easy to implement but it sure as hell is possible.

BIATCH doesn't catch Rate of Fire/rapid fire hacks and I never heard of it catching Nod players accessing GDI PT (don't think there is such a cheat in Renegade). RGH just has PT everywhere. It might actually have support for Nod player accessing GDI PT, but I'm not sure, it doesn't have a console message for it according to their docs and I've never heard about it.

http://www.blackintel.org/renegade/proj ... lemessages

----

From the other thread...

They could just re-install.

You can generate hardware based IDs, for example a hard drive volume serial number. That's what RenGuard did but I'm not exactly sure what code they used. Might be this WIN32 API function:

GetVolumeInformation MSDN

My examples obviously refered to a likewise use in RenX, not to biatch itself.

[HaTe]

It measures distance from the pt, and if that distance exceeds a certain limit, a log to the server is sent. I actually went and looked up the exact same thing as iran when you had first posted that, but decided it not worth while to argue because I understood your point regardless.

But he is right - RoF wasn't detectable by BIATCH alone. I know because I had to personally ban several players for using it, and the only evidence of them using it was a lack of tracers. If that user had been using RoF with just a sniper rifle, he'd be insanely good and no one would ever figure out what cheat he had.

[Agent]

From the other thread...

They could just re-install.

You can generate hardware based IDs, for example a hard drive volume serial number. That's what RenGuard did but I'm not exactly sure what code they used. Might be this WIN32 API function:

GetVolumeInformation MSDN

I'd avoid Volume-based serials, since you could just have a small volume for Renegade X and recreate it when you're banned. It would also be more likely to cause a collision with other clients, compared to the physical drive's serial (or other hardware components, such as the motherboard).

The serial number is a 32-bit number determined by the date and time on the real-time clock on the current computer[2] at the time of a disk's formatting

[giganticferret]

I'd avoid Volume-based serials, since you could just have a small volume for Renegade X and recreate it when you're banned. It would also be more likely to cause a collision with other clients, compared to the physical drive's serial (or other hardware components, such as the motherboard).

The amount of utter pleeb in here is revolting. Go ahead and add hardware checks, smart people will just hook the API call and spoof what ever data its trying to get to either something random or perhaps something trolly.

APB tried to do this with WMI to query for hardware information and generate a hash to ban off of. Also, IP bans would likely be the best course of action as of now. Until the europeans get a giggle off on how easy it is to change IP when damn near every provider that isn't america, canada or australia is likely using dynamic protocols. good luck.

[HaTe]

If a known cheater and utter troll is posting that you shouldn't do it - do it.

Takes the time to post about how easy is it is to bypass, yet makes sure to mention that you shouldn't do it. Clearly he doesn't want to do the extra work himself.

That's just pure laziness, giganticfaggot. I blame the parents.

[SFJake]

Seriously though, anything that has to be done on the cheater's side like that is bound to be breakable, thats why I think in-game server side checks really are the best to get rid of all the most destructive hacks.

[HaTe]

Seriously though, anything that has to be done on the cheater's side like that is bound to be breakable, thats why I think in-game server side checks really are the best to get rid of all the most destructive hacks.

aimbot is one of the most destructive and there's no real server side check that can detect it.

[giganticferret]

If a known cheater and utter troll is posting that you shouldn't do it - do it.

Takes the time to post about how easy is it is to bypass, yet makes sure to mention that you shouldn't do it. Clearly he doesn't want to do the extra work himself.

That's just pure laziness, giganticfaggot. I blame the parents.

Extra work? Yea, it's not like someone has already written a nice little example of usage or anything.

I think you may be half retarded because my post clearly says "go ahead and do it" because the only ones that get banned by it and affected by a hardware ban would be the people wrongfully accused, as the guilty wouldn't receive the ban in the first place given they can spoof it. How the fuck do you breathe the same air as i do? By now I'd have thought inbreeding would have led you to develop gills.

aimbot is one of the most destructive and there's no real server side check that can detect it.

wrong again retard. fairfight is built around stat tracking. hits landed, bones hit, kdr, kills per second, etc etc. Good lord you are a dunce.

[HaTe]

If a known cheater and utter troll is posting that you shouldn't do it - do it.

Takes the time to post about how easy is it is to bypass, yet makes sure to mention that you shouldn't do it. Clearly he doesn't want to do the extra work himself.

That's just pure laziness, giganticfaggot. I blame the parents.

Extra work? Yea, it's not like someone has already written a nice little example of usage or anything.

I think you may be half retarded because my post clearly says "go ahead and do it" because the only ones that get banned by it and affected by a hardware ban would be the people wrongfully accused, as the guilty wouldn't receive the ban in the first place given they can spoof it. How the fuck do you breathe the same air as i do? By now I'd have thought inbreeding would have led you to develop gills.

Pure laziness kid. Needs to cheat using UE3 premade cheats to get his hard-ons.

Not everyone would spoof it. Not everyone knows how or is willing to look up how. Sure, kids like you could bypass it. There's only a handful of immature teenagers that go that far just to pointlessly try to cheat in a free game. You should be honored that you're pathetic enough to make that handful. You're not even doing it to be good. You're doing it solely to prove that you can, and try to get attention out of it by doing so. Not only that, but you then are narcissistic enough to think that people actually think you're cool because you can troll a community's dedicated server in a free-game and think that people will notice you by doing so.

Daddy issues? Or did mom not feed you properly?

"NOTICE ME GUYZ I CAN BYPASZZ UR UE3 ANTI-CHEET!"

(There is no UE3 anti-cheat, good job bud).

[goztow]

Wrong. Rof was detected. As it was not 100 pct certainty it only spit a log warning though. A cumulation of rof warnings was a good indication of a cheat. But lag could sometimes trigger it.

[giganticferret]

Pure laziness kid. Needs to cheat using UE3 premade cheats to get his hard-ons.

Not everyone would spoof it. Not everyone knows how or is willing to look up how. Sure, kids like you could bypass it. There's only a handful of immature teenagers that go that far just to pointlessly try to cheat in a free game. You should be honored that you're pathetic enough to make that handful.

Daddy issues? Or did mom not feed you properly?

Again, you fail to realize this would be automated, meaning any scrublord could be given a cheat with auto HWID ban bypassing built into it. The only real way to combat hacks is server sided checks like fairfight does. In an honest opinion fairfight is to hackers like raid is to roaches. You can't bypass a stat tracker. Unless you are so terrible at cheating that you are better legit. In which case there is a balance met and all is well.

Edit: quoting you AGAIN jesus fuck, the retarded shit you spew is always wrong. You should just stop talking.

"NOTICE ME GUYZ I CAN BYPASZZ UR UE3 ANTI-CHEET!"

(There is no UE3 anti-cheat, good job bud).

http://udn.epicgames.com/Three/Networki ... Prediction

read away scrublord.

Edited March 14, 2014 by Guest

[HaTe]

Wrong. Rof was detected. As it was not 100 pct certainty it only spit a log warning though. A cumulation of rof warnings was a good indication of a cheat. But lag could sometimes trigger it.

Not by BIATCH alone. A player had to have RG or a future scripts version (I think maybe it was 2.3+) in order for it to be detected. It wasn't completely server-side then. That's the point Iran was making.

Again, you fail to realize this would be automated, meaning any scrublord could be given a cheat with auto HWID ban bypassing built into it. The only real way to combat hacks is server sided checks like fairfight does. In an honest opinion fairfight is to hackers like raid is to roaches. You can't bypass a stat tracker. Unless you are so terrible at cheating that you are better legit. In which case there is a balance met and all is well.

Or you could just constantly turn it on and off, and changing which bone the aimbot targets. Any good cheater doesn't just go out and advertise a cheat - he uses it secretly to his advantage. You're not doing it right.

[goztow]

Maybe we had a non public release.on Tk2 then. We had a partnership wih BI back then. EWD can confirm it. anyway does not matter anyway.

[HaTe]

http://udn.epicgames.com/Three/Networki ... Prediction

read away scrublord.

That's discussing client to server and server to client lag. That's not anti-cheat, and any game has this. Renegade's awful netcode has this noticeably more than Renegade X. It's in no way anti-cheat. The only "anti-cheat" implemented by UE3 is to make sure certain files cannot be changed (which can be overrided by a third party program, as you know). The only "anti-cheat" listed in there is the anti-cheat you still have to manually add. Meaning it's not UE3's anti-cheat, but a way to solve certain cheats with UE3 (since it depends on the particular game). UnrealScript can only partially detect certain cheats, and does so poorly. Clearly you're already aware of this.

Keep trying to insult when you clearly don't know what you're on about. You can evade bans like a kid-hero, but it's clear you aren't making these third-party programs yourself. Stop while you're behind.

Edited March 14, 2014 by Guest

[giganticferret]

That's discussing client to server and server to client lag. That's not anti-cheat, and any game has this. Renegade's awful netcode has this noticeably more than Renegade X. It's in no way anti-cheat. The only "anti-cheat" implemented by UE3 is to make sure certain files cannot be changed (which can be overrided by a third party program, as you know).

Keep trying to insult when you clearly don't know what you're on about. You can evade bans like a kid-hero, but it's clear you aren't making these third-party programs yourself. Stop while you're behind.

i feel like im talking to a goddamned wall here.

[HaTe]

The only "anti-cheat" listed in there is the anti-cheat you still have to manually add. Meaning it's not UE3's anti-cheat, but a way to solve certain cheats with UE3 (since it depends on the particular game). UnrealScript can only partially detect certain cheats, and does so poorly. Clearly you're already aware of this.

Also read the "False positives and substantial pack loss" part. It's not built in to UE3. It's something you can add to the code for detection. It's not UE3's anti-cheat (an anti-cheat is a prevention, not a detection, by the way).

[giganticferret]

Also read the "False positives and substantial pack loss" part.

That's why i highlighted the bit about server and client clocks being syncd as well as the dev posting the threshold for the timers for kids with bad ping. which compensates for up to 120% of gamespeed.

It's not built in to UE3.

Now you're trolling as the snippet i sent you is documented code from UE3, code that this game uses.

It's something you can add to the code for detection. It's not UE3's anti-cheat (an anti-cheat is a prevention, not a detection, by the way).

somewhat correct, you can modify it to alert admins etc etc in like ~3 lines of code.

Which is why speedhackers get stuck in place and have

in the topleft....

Anyways, i have shit to do so i'd like for you to take in all we have discussed and realize HWID bans are retarded, please add them for a giggle. Also: while you sit here with nothing better to do, as you do. Please refer to the VERY well documented pages of beyondunreal or the UnrealDevNetwork. thanks and comeagain.

[HaTe]

The UE3 document states specifically that you need external versions in order for the anti-cheat to work. Meaning it isn't UE3 itself stopping the cheat. Hence why you're able to use it, bodboy.

[Xpert]

Wrong. Rof was detected. As it was not 100 pct certainty it only spit a log warning though. A cumulation of rof warnings was a good indication of a cheat. But lag could sometimes trigger it.

Not by BIATCH alone. A player had to have RG or a future scripts version (I think maybe it was 2.3+) in order for it to be detected. It wasn't completely server-side then. That's the point Iran was making.

Wtf are you talking about lol... RoF was detected completely server side without the need of the client having RenGuard or any scripts version. There was a private build of BIATCH that was never released that spat out RoF logs but it never autobanned. They never released it because it was tied into a bunch of other code that they didn't feel like seperating from their servers. I duplicated the same system back in Atomix. People didn't have to have RR, RG or Scripts to be detected. We banned when the intervals were so high or repetitive.

[HaTe]

If it was private and never released then it wasn't part of BIATCH really then, was it? Just saying that in public servers, biatch never detected RoF. I wasn't aware it was BIATCH that made the ROF detection privately, but I knew it existed. It's how wilo eventually 100% proved mibilest0rm was using it (which required him using scripts 2.3+ apparently - I'm no code expert, I just read the posts and changelogs regularly). I had assumed he made the code himself though. Either way, it still doesn't exist within the publicly released BIATCH, so the point still stands. And it was detected by RG (at least the very first version of ROF) if the client and the server both ran RG at least partially.

[iran]

n00bless also had RoF dectection. RG detected it because it's an objects.ddb hack.

[Xpert]

If it was private and never released then it wasn't part of BIATCH really then, was it? Just saying that in public servers, biatch never detected RoF. I wasn't aware it was BIATCH that made the ROF detection privately, but I knew it existed. It's how wilo eventually 100% proved mibilest0rm was using it (which required him using scripts 2.3+ apparently - I'm no code expert, I just read the posts and changelogs regularly). I had assumed he made the code himself though. Either way, it still doesn't exist within the publicly released BIATCH, so the point still stands. And it was detected by RG (at least the very first version of ROF) if the client and the server both ran RG at least partially.

Wilo never had a steady anti-cheat system. He ran a normal standard BIATCH. Take it from someone who's coded for st0rm for a few months and has had hands on the old source code. All his SSGM edits were merely childs play and a bunch of functions that called .txt script files that run in the data folder of the server. There were only a handful of servers that had an OK rapid fire system; BlackIntel, N00bless, Jelly, Nite-Serv (The days of raven, shinigami and stewie as a team) and Mt0wn into Atomix.

Mobilest0rm got caught because I suggested looking at SSGM raw gamelog files that showed the position and kill event of what mobilest0rm was doing and matched it with the video of what was posted for evidence against him.