yosh56

Planetside 2 players would argue you should have to return to base to refill vehicles. But that is neither here nor there. I would argue there are more clever ways to do field ammo, like an ammo pack as an item that takes a beacon-planting animation to deploy. Lastly, snipers? You want to give it to everyone BUT snipers and rocketeers? Just give the rest of the "enough" ammo then. Give all of them an additional clip, to the autorifle, to the volt rifle, even to the marksman and the regular chaingunner. I would be uncertain with Patch, laser chaingunner, Gunner, Grenadier, Chem Sprayer, McFarland, Snipers, or Rocket Soldier, and that's half the infantry. It would be more "across the board" instead of "divide up special niche rules for every little thing in the game" to just increase the carry capacity for weapons that we don't really care about. Especially when we have such a long list of infantry that might need less mag size, let alone total ammo carry size. To humor you, the damage/reload on all those units would need adjusted if they had infinite ammo. LCG, just a slightly longer reload time. Rocket soldier, would need pretty big nerfs indeed, enough to possibly mess with delicate air balance. Snipers would also need longer reload times and rof times to the point they definitely would lose their Renegade close-quarter charm in the hands of anyone that ain't Yosh. On the other hand, Grenadier would just need nerfs that he already needs anyway. McFarland, had a delicate line, where if you nerf him too much it won't matter how much ammo he has, because he will never threaten anyone and will die in 100% of fights, rendering him an easy avoid-buying class... I only mention snipers because a post from the devs a long time ago mentioned that they felt like snipers would be too camp-friendly with infinite ammo. Me personally, I would just want to go across the board with infinite ammo sans explosives. Pretty sure nothing would feel any more powerful and NEED a nerf just because it can now do things indefinitely, but it still would just be doing the same things it was doing. No more damage; no more reload speed; no extra ammo in its magazine. It literally is just capable of being where it is until you actually dispose of it. A sniper round to the face is still going to make your problems disappear. As much as there's talk about it, I'm pretty sure the only way to test it would be just to put it in effect and see if it really does break anything.

Infinite ammo doesn't imply infinite health or infinite magazines, so in all honesty I don't think this buffs the Volt Rifle too terribly much. If anything it just buffs ALL infantry capable of doing damage to buildings in that now any of them would be able to kill a building. On the flip-side of that, it's not like they can instagib a building any better than they could before. As for 500 rounds being 'indepletable', that basically sums up the purpose of just giving infinite ammo. Most units/players aren't going to run out of ammo anyway, and when they do... well it's just annoying due to having to go find a crate or run all the way back to base to refill. The biggest issue I have with limited ammo is infantry can't actually HOLD a position while vehicles can. This means you completely lose your ability to actually HOLD the field when you lose vehicles due to having to rely on your base to refill your ammo, as well as other people to heal you, as opposed to vehicles which just need heals. In terms of what weapons wouldn't get infinite ammo: we were thinking explosives obviously, and maybe sniper rifles... maybe.

Just curious as to who would be down to test out having infinite ammo for all infantry primaries (save whatever weapons really ought not to have it). We already have a mutator for it, and to be honest I don't really see infantry primaries having infinite ammo as GAME BREAKING. As was said once on this board already, running out of ammo is just more annoying than anything. Sidearms would still be useful in that it'd be faster to switch to a sidearm in 1 second to finish off a target, than it would be to wait 3 and a half seconds (Which is the average reload time) to start firing your primary again.

you and your Chinook>Orca But to remain ontopic: I think it would be interesting to test it out. Like setting up a test server for this. Will do. We thinking Orcas and Apaches lose their lock? Or perhaps just increase the range of the gun so that using the missiles is more dangerous and can get you kited to death ?

Or... just... use a Chinook. Problem solved.

I'm still trying to figure out why the bloody hell they got nerfed. There was literally ONE complaint (that I saw) EVER posted about their primary needing to be nerfed. Seriously, nobody thought they were OP >_>

Somebody please make that topic for having the Hotwire and Technician have 2 separate forms: A utility form and an Specialist one. Same class, same person, just 2 load-outs to cut down on making any new models or anything. Think kind of like the arrows on the tier 3 infantry in OldRen that were used for switching their skins, except these would actually change the character's load-out without changing the character itself. On top: SBHs having sidearms is iffy. On one hand their biggest drawback in vanilla is the fact that the laser rifle is about as subtle as a gay pride parade. This was their largest balancing point: they are stealthy, and good at ambushes, but once they're out the jig is up and they better have not fired off their rave guns without making sure no other enemies were going to react to it. Being able to carry something like the Super-silenced Carbine 'fits' the stealth role more, but it fits it so well that it completely breaks the balance that was put in place. SBHs using the tib weapons... well I still just hate the way tib weapons were implemented anyway. I don't voice it a lot, but I wouldn't even care if they totally dropped out of the game without explanation. --- Once more, I simply like the idea of breaking up sidearms into the two categories of actual sidearms, which have infinite ammo/replace the pistol whilst not being super amazing, and second primaries that could be something like Carbine or Tib-Auto rifles: just as strong as a tier 1-2 weapon but replace C4, effectively turning you into a full assault class with full focus on just being a killing machine.

The smoke grenades already works in this way. I think that the detonation time is the most problematic thing about it, in that it needs to be a very fine line. Go too far in either direction, and it quickly becomes too powerful or useless. I personally like where the detonation time is at now. I just wish that it would explode on impact with vehicles because as of now, they are VERY rarely used for this purpose (because of that detonation time, but the same detonation time works perfectly for disarming mines right now). We've been through the detonation on impact phase. It was this way in beta 3, and it was the biggest complaint with EMP grenades. It took absolutely no skill whatsoever for a single player to nullify an entire rush. Is the fuse too long? I'd say so. 5.5-6 seconds is a bit too steep. At most, it should be about 3, but no detonation on impact. We've already been through that terrible time.

Is this the part where I bring up that broken eco broke EVERY aspect of this game... again? I don't think I've ever had a point where I had to 'decide' to buy a sidearm.. I just either did or didn't. I also still propose reworking sidearms to differentiate between actual sidearms that replace the pistol, and second primaries that replace the C4 slot, or both C4's on the Tech. Sure it's more work, but in all honesty I feel like the system itself was implemented in a broken manner. This would also let us justify moving the Fletchette gun to a sidearm, and nerfing it considerably, while the auto rifle was a second primary weapon that was actually worth buying over the Fletchette.

This.. The thing is though that lots of guns are semi-capable, its just that people in general dont really think of using them. Carbine, autorifle, heavy pistol and even marksman etc.. If 3 people used any of these at the same time then the orcas HP will drop fast enough for it to have to retreat. But alas i always find myself being the only one frantically emptying weak shots on flyers. This is the primary reason we went ahead with letting so many gun weapons be hit-scan. We were drawing away the Ramjet being the only real good AA infantry weapon by letting the Officer and other weapons be dangerous toward Orcas.

Quote for truth. The PIC is probably the sole weapon that feels like it no longer needs to be touched (aside from maybe range as stated earlier). The problem is people whined about tier 1 infantry being just barely better than the free classes...and that's kind of how they were supposed to be. Umm, well that was a stupid point to bring up. Repairs on vehicles + snipers basically counters any infantry not in mass... so that was pointless. It also only takes 2+ Rocket soldiers to overpower the repairs of a single Technician, which is the same number it takes for the PIC. No, it does outright great vs. heavy armour ESPECIALLY for just $225 and being around without a Barracks. Couple that with infinite* range and the problems only get compounded. The PIC may be hit-scan, but also becomes useless outside of like 70 yards. Yet again, people are acting like we're asking to push it back to how it was, when in reality we're just asking it to go back to being a choice as opposed to basically the best choice for the money ALWAYS.

I'm just going to re-iterate it: why on Earth did they DOUBLE buff the Rocket Soldier. They upped its damage to make it 6 hit kill on light vehicles with 400hp, which was good. From 8 hits to 6 was a buff... from 8 hits to FIVE was ridiculous. The only thing limiting the Rocket Soldier is their ammo count, and one could argue their ability to really kill infantry (which a Carbine breaks anyway). That's to say nothing about the fact that it does roughly the same damage to heavy armour, meaning the $225 Rocket soldier is a better choice for defending a base from range, whilst only somewhat losing out to the tier 2 options at mid-range. Don't even get me started on the PIC... I campaigned for it to get a reasonable buff, just for it to suddenly get completely overshadowed again. The launcher definitely doesn't need to go back to being 55 damage all around, but it could definitely stand to go back to the FIRST buff statistics from B4 testing. 75 Damage to light armour and around 65-70 for heavy armour. Seriously, we've broken the tier system entirely. The PIC/Railgun DO NOT need a buff in any way, except possiby range to compensate fro the tank range buff from b2 to b3. They're already powerful, especially if more than 1 of them is on the field at any given moment. As to why you would need to give them a bigger projectile is beyond me. They're a point and click, hit-scan adventure... if you missed well...you just missed. P.S The Rocket launcher and the PIC have roughly the same rate of fire. TL;DR : You should already know my stance on the rocket launcher. Dat ish got BROKE. A rocket soldier and a carbine/tib-weapon is the only offensive infantry you really need anymore to go after vehicles. Maybe use a Lolficcer every now and then to fight off Artillery. STL;DR: Rocket soldier needs that damage scaled back from 80/75 to 75/65

@Hate: Rocket Soldier of course. That thing slowly became a homing $225 Personal Ion Cannon.

1- Officer nerf (kill hit-scan maybe) 2- Rocket launcher nerf (got buffed way too many times in testing) 3. PIC/Railgun range buff 4. Autorifle head-shot buff/body-shot debuff 5. Nerf splash damage in general from infantry units (Farland/Gunner/Grenadier) 6. Gunner buff vs. buildings/vehicles to go with #5 and make him actually more viable than rocket soldiers.

Trolling trolls: as it should be.

Twas a bad exploit; interesting, and we figured it out pretty fast, had a bit of fun privately with it, but still you probably should have just posted it on the forums instead of abusing it. If you actually liked the game you wouldn't try to push as many people out of it in an already minute community.

This ^ Also, I'll see if I can't get some footage/pictures later, but I'm 99% certain the head hit-box on the crouching animation is set too high. Hitting someone that's crouching right between the eyes generally results in a body shot. Hell, I've had people who I couldn't see anything but their head somehow receive body-shot damage.

TMX usually just plays whatever teams the game puts us on. Right now it just feels like beta 4 doesn't mix teams as well as 2-3, so people that do end up on the same team have a pretty high likelihood of ending up with the same people over and over. He, once we have more than about 5 people, we usually switch into individual team TS channels anyway.

You're right, you guys just have a page under mods for non-cnc games http://cnc.wikia.com/wiki/Renegade_X. A portal would have to be created for it. Do we need to actually contact them to have a true portal created, or is it just added to like any other page ?

Just reiterating since this was something proposed awhile ago that a lot of people liked the idea. It just sort of got swept under a rug and forgotten about like several suggestions on this board.

This is iffy, as this part was written as of beta 2-3 where donations+early APC rushes were basically the beginning of the game. There was no waiting period, and often times teams could have people joining exceptionally late. Beta 2 especially, with the crashing issues, meant teams were often uneven as all hell at the beginning, meaning leaving your base when your team was only 6 deep compared to the 10 on the other side was a suicide mission anyway. It's worth thinking about revising now, as APC rushes aren't much of an issue now, but still you're usually more helpful defending the harvester if you know your sprint is going to be used up just getting from the back of the base to the front on a map like Walls. May add some of those in. That one's iffy. Often times I've seen APCs do better by not ever shooting off their gun at all. Idiots on the enemy team come in two flavours though: those that will immediately fall for the audio cue, and just look at a building that EVA tells them to; then there's the one that won't pay attention to either, but also actually responds to vehicles in the distance if they happen to fire at something. Again, it's hit or miss. Generally just being totally quiet has done many an early APC rush good.

Was thinking the same. This would probably be best done with a small group of people. I need to think of who's got a good tutorial voice though.

It's good that somebody didn't just talk about it, and instead made something, however we've got issues. If we want people to watch the tutorial, we're better off making it short, sweet and to the point. It's about mining, so the information about how much damage SBHs do to buildings is kind of superfluous. Having the video be strictly about mining techniques and WHY it's important will suffice. Also, you fail to take into account that you set off that 5-mine-stack through the wall and then simply crouched and walked into the actual spread field. Yes stacked mines do less damage, but a single SBH can also set off all 5 mines in a doorway by themselves and come out with -100+. So in essence, one of the major topics that should be covered is mining far enough away from the door that the mines can't be set off through the wall, but close enough that a Technician can't stand inside of the doorway and disarm them.

Regeneration is a bit too much of a 'given' attribute to really make sense here. You're not given much in Renegade without having to do something. The only exception to the rule really is the credit tick you get just from having a Refinery, and now the 1 credit tick that happens even though you're team lost it (but we won't get angry about that here). Renegade >IS< however a game of rewards. You already get points for hitting things, the reward of higher economy for destroying the other team's Harvester. You take away a team's ability to buy things for destroying buildings. That list goes on. That being said, I think we should just look back at the system that was proposed earlier on these boards about infantry dropping health/armour when killed. If you're good in a 1v1, you should be rewarded with a bit of compensation to health. It's not as though this would just be giving you health for running away (E.g getting sniped on the body then just go hide behind a rock for 10 seconds to heal), but rather compensating you on doing something useful, which is murdering that poor fellow so his ideals will never see the light of day again. This would add to infantry longevity during rushes and in tunnels, but without ever being able to overshadow Hotwire/Technician's ability to fully heal an individual. At least, if we make it tier-based it would help. By tier-based, I was thinking along the lines of. Free Infantry drop the 25hp recovery Tier-1 drop the 50hp recovery item Tier-2 Drop 100 Tier 3 infantry drop a 150 or 200... whatever's around in the resources. Engineers/Hotwires/Techs could in turn only drop armour on death just for the sake of variety. --- PRO vs. CON list: PRO +People can stop complaining that they have to rely on teammates in a team game... +Allow assault infantry to be rewarded slightly more for doing their job +Add some longevity to infantry field bouts without just GIVING it to away +Isn't able to fully heal all of the time, meaning it doesn't make Hotwire/Technicians a novelty. In the field where there isn't much CQC with infantry, it still means Hotwires/Techs will need to be aware of infantry to heal around them. +Snipers/ranged campers wouldn't partake in the benefit, encouraging more CQC +The models for health pick-ups are already lying around from Black Dawn CON -Enemies could potentially pick up dropped health/armour -SBHs walking around with Fletchette guns and Carbines would now be more annoying and able to heal after fights, though that's a different problem all together. -People stealing your hard earned health and stuff, but that's a player issue. ---- Again, this was all proposed awhile ago, but we just all kind of forgot to keep pushing it.

So, for the CnC wikia, would we need to actually create a brand spanking new portal for Renegade X? I had been under the original impression that you all had one already, but I'm seeing nothing to verify that. EDIT: Found it, but damn are you guys buried in there.