Trying to set up a coordinated base defence...

[Cherno]

So, I regard myself as reasonably experienced with most maps that are played nowadays, and I am of the opinion that the foundation of a victory is a good defence. That means that I typically try to organize a structured base defense in the first few minutes of the game after the early rushes are dealt with and mines are being set up. I often take Moebius/Patch or Mendoza/SBH and guard one specific part or single building of the base, such as the GDI PP on Walls (where the doors face the map border and can't be seen from the center of the base), or the PP and back of the REF on XMountain. I run around my chosen patrol area, shooting widly around to catch SBHs and not allowing enemies to hide, rest and plan their attack. Then I communicate via chat which location I am guarding, and ask who will guard the other ones.

In 90% of cases, no one will respond.

It seems strange to me that in a game with a very small player base, which should consist almost exclusively of experienced players, that there is that little interest in a structured defence like this. I assume that most players are fine with just "hoping for the best" which of course means that holes in the defensive screen that ideally envelops the whole base with all blind spots will occur, which WILL be taken advantage of by sneaky Hotties, Gunners, SBHs or Stealth Tanks.

All maps need a good defence, but on some it's especially important, even more so for GDI who has to deal with stealthed units: X-Mountain and Walls are two that spring to my mind immediately.

Any opinions on this? Is this defence solution just not good (never heard any one complain in game, though), or are most people just too casual for "tactics" like this? I don't think it has to do with the less-glamorours job of staying in base the whole match because often there are more than enough people that camp but they do so in a headless manner.

[Fujiwara Chika]

I believe that it actually is related to the glamour of it. Few people want to camp or set up defenses around the base, as they consider that boring - the waiting game. They want to go outside, fight, die, enjoy the action. This is more so in public matches where people tend to care less about winning and more about having fun. However, even in PUGs, there are those who want to be in the lead, to be entertaining themselves with the game as best as they could. And that's quite respectable. For me, I know I suck as a player doing that, so like you, I main defense. I don't think it's wrong to defend, but I'm just saying that it's not for everyone. There's a reason why base defenses are beloved if it's a structure on your team; it usually frees up more players to go out and have fun with others, whether it's shooting up in the field, or planning coordinated sneak-ins with friends.

Think about it. What's fun for you? Go ahead and do it, commit to it. Just know that you'll always have a defender or two right behind you, here and there!

[Handepsilon]

Yea, it's sad really, most people wanna go offense until one of their buildings blow up and that doesn't always push their defense motivation up

[Cherno]

I'm rather bad at FPS games and can't aim very well but I enjoy being the field Hottie/Techie or defending the base

Still, with so many experiences players, it surprises me that more often than not the intricacies (sp?) of each map are ignored. For example, XMountain NEEDS someone to watch a) inf path to BAR b) PP front and especially back plus REF back and c) WF back/bunker cliff. Walls NEEDS someone to guard WF back, tunnel/main entrance, REF back, PP and also a Havoc against choppers. All GDI examples, of course, since NOD can get away without a proper defense more easily on some maps.

[Axesor]

Your question has been answered. Experienced or not, it's not enjoyable for most of people. They/I/We simply don't care. It's good to have players like you in team who find this defending activity actually enjoyable so the rest of team can normally play.

[Cherno]

Yes, although that might be onlz one possible answer. As I wrote before, there are many cases when there are more than enough defenders (seems to happen frequently on Islands) but they just run around in APCs and Moebius without coordination.

[Profane Pagan]

Also about coordination: you should take account the problem with mines. Often it happens, the team can't delete badly placed mines, if they can't ban the crook miner and he/she is refusing to replace the land-mine. So it would be good if the whole team could defuse their own mines. 2 or 3 missing mines from a building, which are sitting outside somewhere could be determinant. Heck! Our adversaries can defuse our mines, why can't we do the same? Was it very off topic?

[MrSeriousOak]

Also about coordination: you should take account the problem with mines. Often it happens, the team can't delete badly placed mines, if they can't ban the crook miner and he/she is refusing to replace the land-mine. So it would be good if the whole team could defuse their own mines. 2 or 3 missing mines from a building, which are sitting outside somewhere could be determinant. Heck! Our adversaries can defuse our mines, why can't we do the same? Was it very off topic?

That I agree with, too a certain extent. Having your entire team to be able to disarm all mines is a good idea, unless you have a troll.

[Cherno]

I agree as well. One should be allowed to disarm all mines regardless of who planted it.

[Crowsy]

Just my opinion, but I think is best to leave the mines as they are now. If the team refuses to ban from mining the player that is destroying the team's mines (after trying to reach out that player and telling them what they did wrong)...then that team is really hopeless for that round. I fear, as Mr. Tree, that if you make mines disarmable by all players it will just give team hamperers more tools to further kill the round for you.

Best thing to do is to try to educate said player to mine correctly and to ban him from mining if he refuses to listen. One way or an other he will have to learn.

Edited May 29, 2016 by Guest

[Profane Pagan]

But think about this: you fear the trolls, but there are only a handful of wrongdoers in the games. Or fewer. And we can always kick them. The majority of the people do honest mistakes when they overmine or place mines at wrong places. And it would save time if a professional player were able to defuse the teammate's mines rather than begging through chat for several minutes. Education is a good thing, but not at the expense of the team. "Hopeless for the round" I am not good with it. At the current state it is like as if a locked and empty vehicle were indestructible, and would stay forever until an opponent can steal it. Not much logic in it. The topic here is about coordinated defense: we have to be able to reach over each other in order to cross-check our defenses.

[Cherno]

One the other hand, it's always possible to see who placed a mine, while it isn't apparent who is defusing mines AFAIK.

[Cherno]

Just had another great moment on Island as GDI when I was trying to coordinate base defense. I said I would guard REF backdoor and asked who would guard BAR and WF. Request was denied by two different people, which was already frustrating. Further pressing the issue lead to one stating that only REF backdoor needs defending while in all other areas traffic is high enough so no one else has to be a dedicated defender. Just when I was typing that I respectfully disagree with that assessment and that this kind of thinking leads to disaster, a stank rolled over me and our REF got destroyed!

[Handepsilon]

It's good to have players like you in team who find this defending activity actually enjoyable so the rest of team can play aggresively.

Fixed that for you, defending is also 'normally play'

Especially in RenX

Island as GDI...

...only REF backdoor needs defending...

I'd love to point out to whoever said that to one of many ancient ways of Stealth Black Hand nuking in Island, witnessed by me at least in Beta 3. Said SBH plants the nuke right on the loading bay spot.

And let's not forget that there are Hovercraft that may or may not house an enemy infiltrator there, be it man or tank.

Also, in Island with high player numbers, have one person place an APC (not buggy/hmw, they're not too sniper-proof) on the tunnel entrance to deny infantry path entry, mostly. A very skilled player or a wave of dedicated anti-tank may plow through, but nevertheless able to give alarm and hold the attacker for awhile.

Or as Nod, you can place a flame tank and each tunnel entrance, flame it and sit around to play sudoku until something amusing actually happens, like infiltrators raging at your permaflame or base being breached. Mostly useful if you don't need too much tank and got too many hotties, and also if you're on full turtle mode. Otherwise though, one tank/apc should be enough.