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Any chance of changing the color scheme on xmountain? The huge amount of red/orange/yellow coloring makes screenshots and streaming turn out to be really low quality unless you have a ridiculous pc/connection.

Also this map is almost entirely red+green so it'd be crazy bad for the most common type of color blindness

"Streaming compatibility" is really the most irrelevant thing, man.

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My laptop is still being repaired anyway so I don't care if it takes a bit longer

*joke involving "gaming" on a laptop*

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is already in March because I'm not seeing beta 4 for download?

wat

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SBHs are the same.

Wait, a dev did say they would be red, and that was particularly an important change as white maps make them invisible even if they were flickering their tongue against your neck, and red stands out on every background of map as well as emphasizes "this is a Nod unit".

I've frequently noticed SBHs when I defended as GDI on Whiteout.

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About making havocs into a kind of infiltration class; How about giving it a ca. 3 sec invisibility with a long cool-down?

Something strong like this would of course mean stripping the unit of the ramjet.

@Gaysha; What's a "mote"?

Recoil is -worse- when its not random because it implies that to learn a gun, you need to learn recoil pattern. I personally hate this stuff, its just ridiculous and gets in the way of the simple fun of shooters. I could never enjoy Counter-Strike because of how the shooting works. You don't make the players learn recoil patterns, its absurd.

As much as I hate recoil, I'd take random ANY DAY over patterns. If its just an obvious, linear recoil, or just a light recoil, then thats not too bad.

See, I personally think every game that isn't an arena shooter, like UT, automatically gets better with recoil.

I agree that random recoil is better, simply because it's more believable.

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Yes, now that you mentioned it, they are still too loud.

Orcas are the main reason why I put its audio channel much lower than anything else. Especially when there are 3 or more Orcas it's an insane sound.

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please... lower the intro sound....

While it is undeniably too loud, you can just remove/rename the movie files.

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Have you guys ever considered having grenades in weapon slot 4 so infantry can flush out corner snipers without having to give up timed c4?

I think it's better to have them replace it.

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and when you have entire teams spamming airstrikes at the same location are you trying to tell me thats fun gameplay?

even 2 people doing an airstrike at the same location is the very opposite of fun for the recieving end. and there is no limit of how many airstrikes can be done. not only is the damage extremely not fun to recieve from an uncounterable force, in a lot of situations there isnt anywhere else to go. NOT ONLY THAT but the GDI airstrike is the most annoying collection of sounds in the whole world.

I've barely used airstrikes, since they mostly seem like a waste of money to me.

I can do a lot more damage usually with investing that money into a unit (unless I get one shot killed from a sniper haha). Increasing the laser's visibility/"deploy time" is an idea that can be discussed, but I don't see why they should do less damage etc.

But I do absolutely agree that the maximum sound for an airstrike is pretty extreme.

the economy is also so bad in this game that you never dont have thousands upon thousands of credits, so the airstrikes cost wouldnt even matter unless they costs upwards of 4000 credits a pop

I can not even begin to fathom after playing the original for SO LONG why any dev claiming to be recreating renegade would do that, it is beyond rediculous.

the game is being watered down completely and people are like "yea thats good, good job devs wowsers" fucking really now..... oh my god.

How many more people do you think would play this game if the devs would stop with the unbearably bad balance decisions and actually make the game closer to its roots? im not sure why you would set out to alienate the very people who were most likely going to want to play the game FIRST.

Bitch, please.

Nobody is claiming to "recreate" the original Renegade in a 1:1 manner. If you would have looked at the game more closely, you would have realized that there are many differences that go beyond the airstrike, that make RenX a quite different game.

I'd also strongly disagree with RenX being "watered down".

I don't think that Renegade has a bigger long-term audience than a few hundred players. And very certainly no balance change in any shape or form would change that.

You also don't seem to understand that we are actually talking about these changes right here, right now, precisely because the devs know the game is not finished yet and are still working on it with the few players the game has. Possibly it's just me, so don't take this as an offense, but... maybe you could direct your criticism into a more productive form instead of just shouting that it all sucks and "what the fuck are the devs even doing!?" kind of way?

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It has started...

The beta testing has started...

Where?

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There was no argument on those posts into why RNG spread is a good idea for snipers. Learn to read, CWC. All I see is that snipers are overpowered, which is true. We all know that. Nobody is saying why having hip spread is a GOOD idea.

I really could just copypaste what I wrote in response to you last time.

You got answers, you just don't want to accept them.

So instead of answering my question you're trying to attack me?

He wasn't attacking you at all, man.

CQB stands for Close Quarters Battle.

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And considering the Carbine is already a ridiculous weapons that tech can normally get... (if nothing else, we need a global options for techs to be unable to get secondary weapons, bought or dropped, would that be fine? And that would be good for normal game balance, too)

That would seem really awkward to me, singling out the tech classes as being the only ones that aren't allowed to buy weapons.

However, the carbine can definitely get a change of some kind. Why not just replace it with the standard machinegun of the soldier?

Because soldier itself exists in 0 price?

Uh, what...?

I don't see what that has to do anything with being able to upgrade your horrible standard pistol.

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And considering the Carbine is already a ridiculous weapons that tech can normally get... (if nothing else, we need a global options for techs to be unable to get secondary weapons, bought or dropped, would that be fine? And that would be good for normal game balance, too)

That would seem really awkward to me, singling out the tech classes as being the only ones that aren't allowed to buy weapons.

However, the carbine can definitely get a change of some kind. Why not just replace it with the standard machinegun of the soldier?

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Also if you are getting shot in the base, try moving smarter.

Yeah, that won't work on Walls or Whiteout when you have to get out of the base somehow.

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Suggestion: Why not remove the reticule for the sniper rifles, instead of adding spread?

But I still want to live with Renegade, not with modern-shooter mechanics that ruins the mechanics of anything. We just need to understand to make maps accordingly.

I like the maps a lot and think every other class and vehicle is balanced around them pretty well, the problem are the snipers.

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Also one other point. I very rarely scope. I play this game pretty much like I play UT, Tribes, and Quake and it has worked well for me thus far. However, now you're changing my play-style without any argument to back it up. You have nothing and we've given you MANY arguments, many examples, many counter examples and yet we're pretty much being ignored. Even if I'm just one person, you're going to kill my gameplay. I didn't want to bring up the victim card but my hand is being forced.

You were given the explanation that Havoc etc. right now are OP and unfair, for some more for some less. Something must be done.

And as a matter of fact, in Renegade it is really easy to hit something without having to use the scope. That's not as much of a problem for standard infantry, since one bullet doesn't do a lot of damage.

A Havoc/Sakura is basically a running OH-KO death machine with instant hits (hitscan).

I didn't want to say this at first, but since you kept going on about it, I am not sure why you're saying that it takes a lot of skill. Because playing the sniper classes, it takes NO skill at all to kill anything. Whenever I happen to pick up a sniper outfit from a crate I easily kill 5~7 people without breaking much of a sweat. No other class lets you do that.

Go play a sniper in a Battlefield game and you'll see how much different and difficult it is to play there.

I'm not saying Renegade is BF or should be BF, but I'm saying the snipers in Ren(X) are cheap and overpowered classes.

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I'm seeing a few people suggesting removing ramjets, would you guys be open to that idea? I'm not sure how people who prefer snipers would feel about that, specifically talking to you Bananas.

Well, I am pretty biased since I hate snipers in every single multiplayer game (I guess Sniper Elite doesn't count haha) and since C&C Renegade and BF Vietnam I've always, in every single MP game, as much as possible played on servers that have snipers disabled or on auto-kick. Actually not the class itself but the rifles, e.g. in BF3 you can still play as recon if you use weapons like the AS VAL.

But my main problem with RenX is just getting one shot killed in any way or form when you just bought a 250+ HP unit. I don't mind a Havoc doing up to 230 HP damage headshot damage on any unit, but anything more than that just seems ridiculous to me and makes me not want to play the game at all whenever I get 1 shot killed in the GDI base as a Patch (it happens frequently on Walls). I hate it. Especially with hitscan it can make the game unplayable and utterly frustrating.

What Jake said is true, we don't always need compensation. However, with the huge dmg nerf I'm talking/dreaming about, I'd also greatly reduce the money cost to 450 and 800 of the sniper classes.

Unfortunately the community for RenX is relatively small and there are no "no sniper rifles" servers, so I have to vent my opinion here, even if it does negatively affect players that love to play snipers.

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Ap2000, the ramjet(Sakura/Havoc) gets damage nerf into 150, in addition to spread. Light vehicle damage is also nerfed while heavy vehicle damage is buffed to compensate it.

Thanks.

I started to understand that as I went reading other comments. haha

Well, the dmg decrease makes me very happy!

And making the hip firing less viable is also very much needed.

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I didn't read every single post on the past 5 pages Now I did!, but am I seeing this correctly that the buyable snipers (specifically Sakura and Havoc) are not getting a damage nerf (which is immensly needed), but weapon spread (which seems weird)?

Or maybe I am just misunderstanding the terminology, since I am not fully aware of all the weapon names and stuff. Sorry about that.

Great changes to the 1000 credits snipers! I FULLY agree with making less damage. And the hip fire randomization at long distances seems like a very good thing too.

(Camping) snipers were already a very big problem in the original, so something must be done against them. Back then admins just limited their amount or ran non-sniper servers.

Of course a no-Havoc/Sakura server-side option would be the best thing, but them one hit KO'ing Patches etc. is just laughable (yes, even when you headshot).

EDIT:

I'm going to edit this post with stuff/comments I read.

These changes are very weird. Why spread while hip firing? I saw you said it won't impact them at close ranges, so why? 80% of my sniper shots are hip fired. I don't want to be forced to use the buggy scope that makes you move super slow. Nothing will make me rage more than missing a shot because of spread.

I don't see what adding spread is aimed at. If you are trying to nerf skill, it won't change much. Most of the really good snipers are just good at aiming. They could grab about any weapon and shut down an area of the map.

Because the way it is right now, snipers NOT having to use scope/precise aim is a huge problem.

Möbius and Mendoza are utterly useless right now, because the high-end snipers are just that more effective at nearly everything else, especially against infantry.

Crates adjustments

Why remove the RNG from the crates?

Having it being a bit of a gamble is the fun thing.

"Do I run into the crate as a SBH and hope for a refill since I'm only at 60HP or do I try to get home?"

Stolen vehicles dont count towards the vehicle limit of either team anymore.

This is a bad change.

Vehicle stealing was a HUGE part in the old Renegade. The enemy having one vehicle less to use was a good strategical advantage.

Added check to prevent players from placing beacons inside their own base (the check is based on the spotting locations/buildings if the nearest spotting actor is a friendly building the beacon cant be placed. The player gets a message informing him about it)-

Why?

This is another tactic that can be used to scare the enemy.

@Air balance; I think a 50 HP nerf on air vehicles would be a good thing indeed, as some others suggested similar things. I personally don't see why only the RL unit works as an AA, but the Officer/Laser Chaingunner too. At least I've used both of them on Walls as such and they do a decent amount of damage for what they cost.

@EMP grenade; This is a cool idea, but it needs to be balanced very well or it's going to be OP for NOD very fast.

@Misc changes; A lot of nice improvements for the GUI and server-side options. Especially small annoyances like wrong hit indicators. Making the nades better is also much welcomed.

@Buggy/HMV/APC; WHAT? That thing already controls weird as fuck! lol

@Chainguns/Laser-chaingun; I don't see why this weapon needs any changing and this sounds like a bad idea.

-- (off-topic) Allow destroyed buildings to be repaired: i know this is a huge change and will not make it in this or few next betas. but it will prevent the players leaving when one of their buildings get destroyed and will give a hope of comeback to that team. you can either require a huge repair with repair gun (like 50 times the building health) to rebuild it or scatter (or put in crates) resources like steal, wood, etc. in map so players can collect them and when they have a required amount the building gets rebuilt.

This is an absolute no-go.