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How you like Mesa changes?


Ryz
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First of all thanks for all the effort which was put in the new release!

While beta testing I brought up concerns about the changes in field and mesa. While field doesn't bother me I have to say some changes in Mesa do. I like to know how other people feel about this. It's not that I want to (or am in a position to) force any changes, but feedback is always good.

I knew the tunnel was 'removed' in Mesa for vehicles to prevent camping. The times I played beta4 I noticed:

- Nod as usually has huge benefits of stealth through both sides

- Nod Can pound the base from both sides now while GDI has a harder time getting MRLS over --> SBH with c4 is end off MRLS

- One chemguy can defend the whole tunnel all game and there is almost no way to get in. And believe me I tried all game...

For me this lead to a game where Nod was camping us again (but now not from the usual spot) and we couldn't get out of the base, neither through tunnels nor via both sides. I feel like the changes are having the same 'camping' effect in a different spot, so this didn't lead to any gameplay advantages for now.

Once the base defense is down, and the PP is easy reachable als NOD, there is just no way to stop them.

It's to early to judge, but I want this topic to be a place to discuss they changes so everyone can give his / hers opinion.

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It's a lot better. But I'm going to disagree, this map is still GDI sided because it focuses a lot on tank play (where GDI excels). Nod's best option in this map is infantry rushing the PP because of the rocks and boxes are covering the AGT. If GDI mines them off, there really isn't anything Nod infantry can do because the AGT covers WF and both sides of the base easily.

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It's a lot better. But I'm going to disagree, this map is still GDI sided because it focuses a lot on tank play (where GDI excels). Nod's best option in this map is infantry rushing the PP because of the rocks and boxes are covering the AGT. If GDI mines them off, there really isn't anything Nod infantry can do because the AGT covers WF and both sides of the base easily.

You're forgetting... Smoke & EMP grenades! :D

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Yep count in smoke grenades and emps:

EMP + SBH --> easy stop rush: flamer attack to finish them, or just use arties

Smoke Grenade --> Even more easy to reach WF / PP, but can do it without.

Might play this evening and I think I am gonna count GDI and Nod wins / loses. So far I only played games with GDI losing, but can't compare based on a few matches.

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TBH I liked the old version more. The cave was something what defined the map for me coupled with the silo being out of the way of vehicles. Silo being in the middle of harvester's road not only makes for just one point of interest to control, but creates "winners win harder" situations like the silo in Field does. As for the cave, other solutions to cave camping could have been taking the cave's roof off to allow airstrikes/larger LoS for base defences. Also, right now veh routes feel too far away from each other.

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I also would have preferred the cave stay, its one of those changes I was ok with but has led to mesa becoming one of my worst maps to play now. Not that its much worse now then before but I agree that the cave was iconic and I think it should have stayed. It was less a point of stalemate then people think. It became a stalemate because the other paths were vastly underused when one team owned the cave.

But things are the way they are now I guess... Still want the silo and vehicle routes swapped again tho :)

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It feels like someone is holding pillows over everyone's faces when this map comes up now. If it doesn't end in the first 5min, it's just really stale and slow for the whole game. The new silo is even more campable, vehicle paths are too narrow, infantry paths and the whole map in general is too clustered... it just never really feels like the map gives you any opportunities to make something interesting happen.

Too much fashion over function going on with the maps imo. Kenz your maps look great but deadstoping on the edges of bumpy floors constantly, getting stuck on friendlies because tunnels are too narrow, having fireflies in my face all the time, etc just ends up being really annoying imo. Keep shit simple please, things like visual clarity and being able to move around the map smoothly should be higher priorities than how pretty it's going to look in screenshots

Edited by Guest
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I have to agree on one thing: clarity.

Please by all the gods get rid of the fog and if possible, make tihngs more clear.

In Renegade X, its hard to spot people in some maps in the daylight compared to Ren. In a map like Mesa its just painful. In fact, I don't ever see anyone at a distance, I just glance and notice them with my magical crosshair.

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  • 3 weeks later...
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I like it more now than I ever have, and have never had a problem with the atmosphere as far as visibility, unlike old Renegade this has the visibility of a modern shooter which iirc was the goal...

...however, in hindsight, now that I think of it, Mesa would probably benefit from having 3 vehicle paths, considering it is one map that has the most advantages to infantry in vehicle areas, as the cave has tons of rocks and cover as well as ramps up and down that vehicles don't have, and the side paths have tons of rocks and towers and knooks and crannys. If you want the Silo to be protected from vehicles, do it artificially with rocks or fencing. Just stick it on the side the harvesters aren't on, and stick a perimeter of debris preventing vehicles of having line of sight to the silo mct. Infantry can easily still reach it either walking the outside edge from base, or running from the cave bridge to the silo.

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