TDM / DM / Mini-C&C / Visceroid (Tiberium Zombie) Gamemodes

[Fr3EdOm]

Promised myself I would make a thread about the possibility of implementing TDM / DM / Mini-C&C / Visceroid gamemodes for diversity. C&C mode will undoubtedly remain as the main gamemode, but I'm sure newcomers to Renegade-X will appreciate a familiar style of gameplay. TDM and DM were easily manipulated in C&C Renegade by simply throwing players into a mission map (M01-M13.mix) and literally boxing them in an arbitrary area by means of a duplicated giant crate object available in the level editor. Very much lulzy... so much so that it was a nice break after a long C&C mode Marathon match.

The possibilities for Ren-X are endless, especially considering the implementation will be much more proper. Brand new maps designed specifically for each gamemode, appropriate use of bonus characters that do not belong in C&C mode, a potential intermission-type gamemode between long AOW / Marathon matches, etc.

TDM - Throw players in a small map with random spawn locations for each team with weapons, vehicles and refill crates scattered around the map. Each player will spawn as a random character from either Nod or GDI, respectively dependent upon the team they are placed. The starting weapon can be debated, but a pistol or automatic rifle would be ideal.

DM - Similar concept of TDM, but free-for-all.

Mini-C&C - Each team will be equipped with their infantry building, HON and BAR, and perhaps a tiberium silo. Either way, there will be a steady flow of about 4 credits per second for each team. The battle will take place on a very small map. That's it. C&C mode on meth... in a very small map.

Visceroid / Acolyte / Initiate (Zombies) - This is the gamemode that i'm really pushing for. The idea comes from a zombie modification for COD2 that was really popular way back when. The concept is very simple. The map begins with every player spawning as a surviving GDI or Nod soldier except one randomly selected, unfortunate soul who will be the initial visceroid / acolyte / initiate in replace of the traditional zombie. GDI and Nod have autorifles and will work together to survive. When the visceroid kills a survivor, they become a visceroid. The game ends when everyone is a visceroid. The tiberium "zombie" team will only be equipped with a type of melee bite or tiberium crystal stab attack, but they have a slightly faster walk / sprint speed. One stab / bite is a kill. Here's the curveball, COD2 pitted survivors against zombies. Ren-X can progress the gamemode by forcing two groups of survivors, GDI and Nod, to work together against the visceroids. They have the option of killing each other, but doing so will only create more visceroids to fend off. The option of allowing this to occur will be up to the server owner.

Alternatively, TDM, DM, and Visceroid modes may offer the choice between a limited number of starting weapons and eliminate the need for picking up scattered weapons around the map in TDM and DM.

A brief recollection of TDM, DM and Mini-C&C mode in the original Renegade:

The history of TDM as I saw it progress in C&C Renegade begins with Mission DM, although I regrettably forget the specific name of the server that hosted it (Rencorner possibly?). Players spawn at random locations around the map as the basic soldier character and pick up weapons and vehicles that also spawn at set locations around the map, along with yellow "refill" ammunition boxes. This evolved into spawning as a random character from either GDI or NOD respectively depending on the team of the player, bonus characters included.

Enter Kamuix TDM / DM sometime after. Kamuix was my inspiration that ultimately led to my leveleditor addiction and subsequent maps on Wittebolx TDM. Getting back on track, Kamuix was the first to introduce purchase terminals in TDM mode. Might seem silly, but people really enjoyed it. A DM mode was also introduced, in which players would spawn on the white / neutral team and duke it out in a free-for-all gamemode similar to that of MissionDM.

Eventually, Kamuix introduced shoddy prefabbed structures to areas of certain mission maps that were lacking an opposing structure. For instance, if a mission map had an advanced HON (with a basement, card-locked doors and holo-kane) and no Infantry Barracks, a prefabbed BAR would be placed in an appropriate location, both modified to be completely destructible. Ultimately, this created a sort of mission map mini-C&C mode. I would really enjoy seeing such a gamemode in Ren-X, on a small map with just a Barracks and HON, for instance.

Let the debate begin!

[TP|himselfXD]

I like all the ideas to be honest. If a TDM/mini-cnc mode is made I would host a server for it.

[HaTe]

Or have DM work like Gun-Game in Call of Duty. Everyone starts off with an automatic rifle. As soon as they kill someone, they get the next gun. First one to successfully get a kill with all of the guns (or goes around twice through all of the guns, for Renegade's sake) - wins. The last guns are the most difficult to get a kill with (you could have this be a few grenades or something). They die, they wait 5 seconds and respawn with the weapon they were at.

[Daedhart]

Meh, I remember that annoying snow maze map that was a free-for-all back in renegade. Thats pretty much what this sounds like. I hated that map, personally.

Zombie idea might be cool, but theres gotta be a better implementation than that. I would purposely seek out the visceroid just so I could be a troll L4D style for the lulz. Maybe make it so that the "alive" peeps have guns that heal the visceroids and turn them back into humans...until theyre ganked again. Then the point would be to get everybody turned either human or mutant.

And mini-CnC mode just sounds like a sniper map.

[Rancid]

I like all the ideas too, though I'm not a big fan of death matches anymore. They bore me, but renegade is a game outside the box so I'm interested to see whatever ideas the community can come up with to keep DM interesting. That zombie idea is good too and I usually hate zombie games, but again, renegade's not your typical killfest orgy so shit, I'm open to any new ideas you guys can come up with

I reckon if the servers get populated enough, it'd be cool to see maps with full building structures that have underground complexes etc. instead of just the first/second floor. But that would only be interesting if the maps had at least 60 players on them probably. Plus in any case, once people start getting into renx mapping/modding I'm sure every idea under the sun will be tried by someone! Can't wait.

[cirex]

None of the ptions above. CTF could be interesting, but everything else sounds boring.

[Fr3EdOm]

Forgot to mention, once I get a firm grasp on the UDK, I will gladly make maps for the TDM / DM / Tiberium Zombie gamemodes just as I did in Renegade. I already have hundreds of map ideas floating around in my head for Tiberium Zombies.

Meh, I remember that annoying snow maze map that was a free-for-all back in renegade. Thats pretty much what this sounds like. I hated that map, personally.

You're talking about one map out of thirteen mission maps that were used for TDM / DM, dude, not to mention the mission maps were not intended to be used for multiplayer. Only reason they were used is that the scripts at the time did not support autodownloading, and everything had to be done serverside if you realistically wanted traffic to your server. There will be brand new maps made specifically for each gamemode. And again, this is only one idea for DM. Could be that most people favor Hate's idea for the COD gun-game style DM.

Zombie idea might be cool, but theres gotta be a better implementation than that. I would purposely seek out the visceroid just so I could be a troll L4D style for the lulz. Maybe make it so that the "alive" peeps have guns that heal the visceroids and turn them back into humans...until theyre ganked again. Then the point would be to get everybody turned either human or mutant.

This could potentially be another form of this gamemode, but would defeat the purpose of the COD2 zombie concept that has proven to be an absolute blast. Funny you mention that you would search for the visceroid (zombie), as many people would do exactly what you described and get fucked either by running out of ammo and not knowing how to properly use their knife or getting stranded in the middle of nowhere after all of their hunting buddies were infected and converted, eventually getting overwhelmed by the very same people who became zombies. But to play devil's advocate, some hunting parties did just fine.

It was truly the best zombie game I've ever played, and it wasn't even a game itself, it was a mod. L4D and the official COD5 zombies are co-op, which is fine and dandy but it's nothing like playing with 64 people and no bots. Literally every player is involved, teamwork is of the essence for survivors and zombies, lone survivors simply die off within the first few minutes and people become hyper-aware of each map because they're looking for the best hiding / camping spots. Each game would predictably start out very slowly, unless the zombie got lucky and took out several unsuspecting survivors, and pick up speed RAPIDLY towards the middle / end especially when the last survivor is shitting his pants and running around like a chicken without a head. War-torn WWII towns like Carentan in COD2 can be replaced by destroyed GDI / Nod bases, perhaps including "advanced" buildings with underground complexes like in the story of the original Rene, like Rancid mentioned. Forgive me for the rant, I just think it's really cool how tiberium gives us such a great excuse for a cool "tiberium zombie" gamemode.

And mini-CnC mode just sounds like a sniper map.

The BAR and HON, as well as any extra building each team has like a silo will need to be destroyed. There will probably be plenty of sniping involved, but eventually one of the structures will be overwhelmed and destroyed. It's C&C mode, just in a bite-size version.

By the way, don't mean to pick on you Daed. You simply brought up a ton of issues that I thought I could use to flesh out my own explanations of each gamemode. Loving the feedback, everyone!

[Daedhart]

Whatever floats the boat.

I still dont think a free for all caters to Renegade's particular style of play. I may just be stuck in my own ways, but FFA just sounds really boring for Renegade regardless of whether there were custom maps or not.

And what I meant was that I would purposely let the visceroid convert me so I could could lulz over the boring people who wanted to stay human. I just think the point is just not efficient enough. Id have to see your method in action before I would judge. Its fun level would be very dependent on its execution.

And unless you banned mines in mini-CnC mode, it would pretty much be impossible to destroy the enemy's base; which would revert every game to a sniper match.

[Fr3EdOm]

And what I meant was that I would purposely let the visceroid convert me so I could could lulz over the boring people who wanted to stay human. I just think the point is just not efficient enough. Id have to see your method in action before I would judge. Its fun level would be very dependent on its execution.

Here's some footage of the COD2 zombie mod I found on Youtube, playing as both survivor and zombie:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBqZiboC4oU

Keep in mind this is a custom map. Try not to focus too much on it, as it's obviously a very simplistic design. The best zombie moments were on the game's original WWII map setting. It should also be noted that every new player that enters a server will spawn as a zombie, not a survivor, and the last survivor also becomes a zombie when killed.

And unless you banned mines in mini-CnC mode, it would pretty much be impossible to destroy the enemy's base; which would revert every game to a sniper match.

Don't remember any problem with mines in Kam's alpha version, but a very valid point nonetheless.

[Nielsen]

We had plans for what you call "mini C&C mode" with mini bases or rather indeed a barracks and a silo which we refer to as "infantry-only" maps. There's ~3 of them in early stages when a bunch of level designers were doing a 1-hour mapping challenge for fun, turned into 6 hours to an all nighter but those could be finished and implemented later perhaps, no promises though.

As for the rest, that's up to modders I think. We don't have any intention of making a zombie mode but if anyone's interested and if we get patching and toolset to work properly then they can.

[Rex]

The whole point of this game is that it is unique in the fact that it isn't like COD with the TDM and the like. Of course, you always have the option not to play these gamemodes so them being there doesn't make a difference for anyone who doesn't want them, and makes a big difference for those who do. So really, if the demand is there for all/some of them, might as well do them.

[PermaGrin]

Personal Opinion:

It should not take too much (other than mapping to meet gameplay requirements, even then you could just play X game type on an already made map just for the hell of it), to at least have all of the gameplay types that are already supported by default through UDK / UT game types.

As in DM, TDM, Assault stuff, etc...

[Fr3EdOm]

We had plans for what you call "mini C&C mode" with mini bases or rather indeed a barracks and a silo which we refer to as "infantry-only" maps. There's ~3 of them in early stages when a bunch of level designers were doing a 1-hour mapping challenge for fun, turned into 6 hours to an all nighter but those could be finished and implemented later perhaps, no promises though.

Already one step ahead... well played, devs.

As for the rest, that's up to modders I think. We don't have any intention of making a zombie mode but if anyone's interested and if we get patching and toolset to work properly then they can.

Fair enough. I can get cracking on some maps to get the ball rolling. If someone is interested in this concept and thinks they have the knowledge to assist in the creation of such a gamemode, please don't hesitate to post in this thread or PM me directly. I would really revel in seeing this gamemode go live shortly after the open beta is released. Of course, we will also need a 3D model of the visceroid / acolyte / initiate as well as some sort of melee attack function. Food for thought.

[disorder]

Hey what about capture the crystal, you have to capture a Tiberium shard and bring it back to a flag to score points, but it causes hitpoint damage so holding it will kill you. you can drop it/pass it to other players also the player cannot be healed while holding it and cannot pick up after dropping for say 20 seconds, which promotes passing with other players.

[Fr3EdOm]

Would anyone part of official Ren-X mapping team viewing this thread kindly PM me or contact me through Steam about possibly obtaining some of their static meshes for use in some miscellaneous gamemode maps such as the ones listed. At this point in time, I'm completely void of any C&C-universe objects. Would love to have some tiberium crystals and other miscellaneous static meshes, with the mappers permission of course.

Hey what about capture the crystal, you have to capture a Tiberium shard and bring it back to a flag to score points, but it causes hitpoint damage so holding it will kill you. you can drop it/pass it to other players also the player cannot be healed while holding it and cannot pick up after dropping for say 20 seconds, which promotes passing with other players.

I like your thinking, brotha!

[havoc1482]

I like the Zombie idea. Those mods were always fun. It would be awesome if you were placed onto an eerie map, like really infested zone and hand to fend off tiberium monsters. Funny thing, if anyone ever decided to undertake a Tiberian Sun version of RenX (Like the TS version of Vanilla Ren) you could have the zombies be CABALs cyborgs.

I also like the idea of overwhelming numbers of AI zombies too. Call of Duty 4 had a mod that pitted players against a massive amount of AI zombies and it was always a desperate struggle to survive, which made the gamemode really fun.

Of course RenX is still in beta, but the creative process is what makes PC gaming so great, RenX is an example of that.

I urge everyone to not take a bias about these ideas. The zombie mods for CoD4 and previous versions have survived the test of time, something all Renegade players can appreciate. They have a proven formula and its worth looking into. They aren't like the shit zombies in later incarnations of Call of Duty which were basically bastardized versions of the PC mods created to drive profit.